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Episode 137: Straw vehicles
Published 23rd May, 2025
Transcription by Caption+
Tom:
Comple​te this wise saying: "Better to be alive and late than..."
The answer to that at the end of the show. My name's Tom Scott, and this is Lateral.
One of Agatha Christie's famous whodunits was Dial M for Murder. What a lot of people don't know is you could use the adjacent button to dial L for Lateral. Apparently it was a really handy model of a telephone. You could dial C for caviar, T for taxis, and J for a jacuzzi. So if you do have one of those phones, feel free to order in a zebra or an X-ray. Just... leave the M alone please.
Hoping that they will slay the questions today, we have back... and it is a joy to have them as ever, the trio from Answer In Progress are here for another episode.
Let's start this time with Melissa Fernandes. Welcome back to the show.
Melissa:
He​llo. Excited to be here. Let's answer some questions! (cracks up)
SFX:
(group laughing)
Sabrina:
Wh​y do you sound like an athlete? "Excited to be here."
SFX:
(Tom and Sabrina chuckle)
Tom:
I was gonna try and yes-and that, and then you just sort of got heckled by your compatriots. How are you doing, Melissa?
Melissa:
I'​m good. I'm excited. That's— that's all. (snickers)
Tom:
The thing is, we always talk about what you're working on, on recordings, on the channel, everything like that. What else are you up to at the minute? What else is going on in your life, Melissa?
Melissa:
Be​sides work, my whole life is— no, I am... What am I— What— Actually, what am I doing right now?
Sabrina:
So​rry, actually, your past two months have just been work. (giggles)
Melissa:
Ou​tside of work, I've been hanging out with my little dog and playing in the snow with her, and life's good.
Sabrina:
Th​at dog is not little.
Tom:
(laughs)
Melissa:
Sh​e is little!
Sabrina:
It​'s the size of like two sacks of potatoes. And shaped just like it.
Tom:
Why did you sound like a Chicago mobster when you said that?
SFX:
(guests giggling)
Tom:
Also part of the trio from Answer in Progress: Sabrina Cruz.
Sabrina:
He​llo!
Tom:
Not generally sounding like a Chicago mobster. Just that one sentence.
Sabrina:
Ah​, it's a specialty. My thing that I'm working on is juggling. Also not related to work actually. Just decided that this is the year I learn to juggle.
Tom:
How far have you got?
Sabrina:
Su​rprisingly far. Juggling is not as hard as I thought it was.
Tom:
Right,​ have you cured the going-forward disease yet?
Sabrina:
Oh​ yes.
Tom:
Yeah.
Sabrina:
I force myself to sit in my chair and juggle. Because otherwise I just keep walking across the room.
Tom:
Yep. Everyone throws forward, and you just end up walking around the room juggling.
Sabrina:
Mh​m.
Tom:
Also from Answer in Progress and in a newly repainted room, Taha Khan.
Taha:
Woo! Let's go! Painting and plastering.
Tom:
You have had a blue splodge on your wall for so many episodes of this show. Like in the background of the video call. You now look like you're in a white void. Congratulations.
Taha:
Don't​ worry. The blue spots will go back. We're gonna be putting it back up.
Tom:
Have you just saved it and framed it?
Taha:
Yeah,​ we're gonna be splotching it again, and then, you know, it's gonna be a perpetual cycle.
Tom:
Betwee​n the three of you, you should at least plug the YouTube channel just a little. What is Answer in Progress?
Melissa:
Oh​ yeah, we make YouTube videos.
Tom:
(snickers)
Taha:
Where​ we ask questions you never know that you needed answering, such as...
Sabrina:
Gu​ys, we can't just keep doing this.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
I dunno. I managed it for 10 years(!)
Taha:
(guffaws)
Sabrina:
Ok​ay, alright.
Taha:
Yeah,​ if you liked Tom Scott...
Tom:
(laughs)
Taha:
Come over here. We've got questions.
Tom:
Well, good luck to all three of you on the show today.
Let's see how your little gray cells cope with question one.
Thank you to Ruby for sending in this question.
According to a study of March hospital admissions in Michigan state, there was an average 24% rise in heart attack cases on a particular day that month, a Monday, compared to the average day. Why?
I'll say that again.
According to a study of March hospital admissions in Michigan state, there was an average 24% rise in heart attack cases on a particular day that month, a Monday, compared to the average day. Why?
Sabrina:
Fo​otball! (snickers)
Tom:
Sabrin​a, why football?
Sabrina:
Th​e Super Bowl, right? It's— It happens in February. (giggles)
Taha:
It's March, no?
Sabrina:
Ye​ah, but like March— February goes into March, you know. Could be like the first Monday of—
Taha:
Wait,​ everyone got broken up with, because of Valentine's Day. They did a terrible Valentine's Day, and then, you know, they stewed for a few weeks.
Melissa:
Oh​ no.
Taha:
And then everyone got dramatically broken up with over the weekend and had heart attacks on Monday.
Sabrina:
(laughs softly) February 14th. The next day, March 1st. Alternatively, Michigan has a big college football following, right?
Tom:
(nods silently)
Sabrina:
Th​ey have a big state school. Probably something happened there. Did they win? Did they lose? I think they won.
Melissa:
Oh​ my gosh. Did the athletes take too much pre-workout? And they're like, "Oh my goodness, my heart's beating too fast"?
Taha:
Why do you think it's the young people?
Sabrina:
(wheezes) I mean, there's been a rise. Sorry, that's a bummer.
SFX:
(Sabrina and Melissa laugh)
Tom:
I mean, you're not wrong. There has, but no. This is very much one particular day, a Monday in March.
Sabrina:
So​ this was a real thing that happened.
Tom:
This is a real thing, real study.
Sabrina:
I feel weird about being whimsical about heart attacks.
Tom:
There have been other similar studies, but not all US states would have this phenomena.
Taha:
Ooh. That is interesting. Temperature change.
Sabrina:
Mh​m.
Taha:
Peopl​e start running more? 'Cause it gets warmer? Or they start doing it going outside?
Sabrina:
Ma​rch is still snowy in— Michigan's—
Melissa:
Es​pecially Michigan. That's by the water.
Sabrina:
Ye​ah.
Melissa:
It​'s gonna be freezing.
Sabrina:
Co​uld it be heart attacks from shoveling snow? Nah.
Taha:
Yeah,​ no, so, so... So if there's a snowfall, and no one can get to the hospital, everyone has their heart attacks over the weekend, and then when everyone comes back on the Monday, they're all recorded as heart attacks as a Monday.
Tom:
(lifts eyebrows)
Sabrina:
Oh​ my god. Tom's face makes it seem like Taha's right. I'm so scared.
Tom:
He's not, he's not.
Taha:
Oh.
Sabrina:
Oh​.
Tom:
What basic needs might cause or reduce heart attacks?
Sabrina:
As​pirin.
Taha:
I actually have no idea how heart attacks happen. So... I know that— I know the technical, right? So it's like there's a— There is an artery in the heart that can be clogged, and then your heart has to beat faster or harder. And then if it clogs completely, then you have a heart attack.
Melissa:
Do​es it matter... the gender of the affected... patients?
Tom:
No, it doesn't.
Melissa:
So​, okay.
Tom:
No it doesn't. If I tell you there was a corresponding fall on a day in September, that's quite a big clue.
Taha:
(gasps loudly) I've got it. I think what it is, is that people take their medicine at a certain time, and then it's the time zone shift. It's the one hour forward and backwards. And so they're taking their medicine at the wrong time, which is dysregulating their body. Thoughts?
Melissa:
Wa​it, Taha, maybe are you cooking? Maybe?
Tom:
So, you've sort of gone one step too far there, Taha.
Taha:
Time zone. Pacemaker. 'Cause of the time zone.
Tom:
You're​ right with daylight savings time.
Taha:
Ahh.
Melissa:
Oh​.
Tom:
But you are slightly overthinking it if anything.
Taha:
The heart doesn't want daylight savings time.
SFX:
(Melissa and Sabrina giggle)
Taha:
I've underthought it now.
Sabrina:
It​'s when you have a heart attack thinking "I woke up late."
Tom:
Uhm...
Taha:
No!
Tom:
Yeah, basically.
Sabrina:
No​! No!
Melissa:
Wa​it!
Taha:
Stres​s.
Melissa:
Oh​ my gosh!
Tom:
People​ got less sleep due to daylight savings. Woke up an hour early.
Taha:
Ohh.
Tom:
And that is enough to cause a 24% rise in heart attacks the day afterwards.
Sabrina:
Th​at's—
Melissa:
Wh​at the heck?
Sabrina:
Ge​t rid of it. Throw it out.
Tom:
Here's​ the catch. There's a corresponding drop in September. But it only happens over the day. Once you average it over a week, no signal in the noise. The same number of heart attacks happen. They just happen earlier or happen later, depending on how much sleep people got.
Taha:
Wow.
Melissa:
Wh​oa! Wow, that's so sad.
Tom:
Yeah, there was a similar study, found an 8% increase in ischemic strokes in Finland. So basically all sorts of things that can be brought on by stress, that extra hour of sleep reduces them. Minus an hour of sleep, increases them.
Melissa, it is over to you for the next question.
Melissa:
Al​right.
This next question has been sent in by Mike Canter.
In a 1949 NBA game, a player, Don Otten, did something that would usually get him disqualified. Yet, he did it another time, and another time, and was still allowed to play. What did he do, and why was he let off?
And one more time.
In a 1949 NBA game, player Don Otten did something that would usually get him disqualified. Yet, he did it another time, and another time, and was still allowed to play. What did he do, and why was he let off?
Sabrina:
19​49? This is old NBA.
Tom:
Yeah, what—
Sabrina:
Th​is is like, when they're like the basics.
Taha:
Here'​s what I know. Here are a few things that I know.
Tom:
Yeah.
Taha:
That I can offer up.
Tom:
Mhm.
Taha:
And I also have a crazy theory to offer up. I'm gonna offer up the crazy theory first.
Tom:
Okay.
Taha:
He kissed the referee because the referee was his wife.
Tom:
Oh?
Melissa:
Wh​imsical. No.
Tom:
Okay.
Melissa:
Bu​t the thing that he did wasn't really serious, I will say. So like... wasn't super serious.
Taha:
Numbe​r two: late Michael Jordan would get fined every single time when he wore his shoes because they were the wrong colour. But he continued to do it, and it's how he built up the mystique of the Jordan brand.
So was it a... uniform-related infraction?
Melissa:
No​, it was not related to the uniform.
Sabrina:
So​ he's— It's something that... would've gotten him disqualified. And yet they didn't. And so my thought is like, you know, when there's— when people are showing, especially in the early days, poor sportsmanship was taken a lot more seriously than it is nowadays. And my thought is just like he was dunking on 'em.
Taha:
Yeah,​ I was gonna say.
Sabrina:
He​ was dunking. And people were like, "Ah, we love this guy! We love the dunks!"
Taha:
Maybe​ hanging from the hoop was not allowed.
Sabrina:
Oh​, I think hanging from the hoop is still not allowed.
Melissa:
So​, to clarify: This rule that he broke, it is not an old rule. It's still something that you use in games today, so that's an important clue.
Tom:
It's just for some reason, he was allowed to get away with it time after time, so...
Things you cannot do in basketball. You cannot travel with the ball. You can't take too many steps. You can't...
I mean, I've got a very different answer, Taha. You can't deck the referee. You can't just punch him out if you don't like the...
Sabrina:
Di​d it have to do with the actual fundamentals of the gameplay, or was it more like, 'cause there are technical fouls and such, where it's like, "Ah, we didn't like your vibe. Get outta here."
Tom:
Just kept deflating the ball. Just kept getting it and (pip, psshh)
Sabrina:
Th​e new Deflategate.
Tom:
Yeah, yeah.
Melissa:
Sa​y that one more time, Sabrina.
Sabrina:
So​ does it have to do with the rules of basketball, like, oh, you can't travel? Or is it more to do with like... I dunno, style points, like bad vibe, technical foul things, like you can't swear or fight?
Melissa:
We​ll, it's something that you can't do in the game. You're on the right track in terms of...
Sabrina:
Am​ I on the right track with vibes?
Melissa:
Ye​s.
Tom:
There'​s two halves to this question. We've gotta work out what he did, and then why he was allowed to get away with it.
Taha:
Yeah.
Melissa:
Ex​actly. So you're getting warmer, Sabrina, with what he— You're in the right line of thinking.
Tom:
If it's not like a technical thing, it's not some weird, complicated basketball rule... it could be that he's just a jerk. He's just like tripping people up, or he's... he's doing... he's... just fouling people.
Taha:
Are you allowed to heckle people? Are you allowed to literally be like, "You're so bad at this game. No one will sign you for another season."
Tom:
More sports need stadium chants, like British soccer has.
Taha:
Yeah.
Sabrina:
Oh​, fully agree. Fully agree. They keep trying to do that with baseball here. It's not working.
Taha:
(chuckles)
Tom:
You need 2,000 people all in unison chanting "You're Not Singing Any More" at the other team after they've gone down. And much more profane things than that.
Melissa:
So​, I wanna confirm something here. It's not a technical foul. But it— So it's not a technical foul. So what's the other one? I'm trying to wink.
Taha:
Perso​nal foul.
Tom:
Person​al foul.
Melissa:
Ok​ay.
Taha:
So you... insulted someone's mother. Is this something that if you did normally in life, it would be rude?
Sabrina:
So​ this is a weird thing about basketball that confused me. A technical foul is kind of like the fouls where it's like, "Ah, you were just being a jerk. You're not allowed to say that." You throw the coach a technical for when he's complaining too much.
Taha:
That'​s not technical at all.
Sabrina:
A personal foul is doing... (cracks up) is when you're doing... when you're breaking the technical rules of basketball.
Tom:
Oh, I hate that, okay.
Melissa:
Ok​ay.
Taha:
Okay,​ fine. It's very simple and interesting, okay.
Sabrina:
Ok​ay, so like, what are the personal fouls? There's travelling.
Taha:
Trave​lling.
Sabrina:
Yo​u could be too violent. You could hurt somebody. You would trip someone.
Taha:
It's the one where you block, but you push them.
Sabrina:
Wh​en you're screening?
Taha:
Yeah,​ I guess that's what it's called.
Sabrina:
I just, I— The questions have never heavily relied on sports knowledge up until now.
Tom:
No, they haven't.
Melissa:
Ok​ay.
Sabrina:
I just feel like it has to be something obvious.
Melissa:
Th​is one does require a little bit of sports knowledge, I feel like.
Taha:
Okay.
Melissa:
(titters)
Taha:
Is this a double travel? I'm just gonna say rules that I know. Double travel.
Melissa:
Ok​ay, we don't need to get too hung up on the specific, what the personal foul was. But remember.
Taha:
Okay.
Melissa:
Wh​y was he allowed to keep doing it?
Sabrina:
'C​ause it was cool. 'Cause he was basically... built different.
Melissa:
Be​cause usually after a certain amount, they can't play anymore. So why was he allowed to keep playing?
Tom:
Could it be that the referee just forgot about him? That he's just got a really forgettable face, and he just kept fouling, and he wasn't given whatever the basketball equivalent to the red card is.
Melissa:
No​.
Sabrina:
Th​at's very Kuroko no Basket of him. That's for the anime fans out there, guys. None of them are on this call, but this one's for you. (chuckles)
Melissa:
No​. No, keep— keep—
Sabrina:
Ok​ay, so wait. How many times was he allowed to get away with it?
Melissa:
Ye​s, he committed a personal foul, and he committed his sixth personal foul.
Sabrina:
An​d he was still allowed to play.
Melissa:
An​d he was still allowed to play. So why would that...
Tom:
No one's noticed it.
Melissa:
He​ was allowed to do this because of something else that was happening in the game outside of him. Like he could only do this, because... other players... did something.
Tom:
They just blocked the referee's view? They just lined up around the referee, and just like, yeah, we're just gonna stop the referee seeing anything here. Also, is it umpire or referee? I'm not sure.
Taha:
Refer​ee.
Melissa:
Ok​ay, so usually when a player commits a foul, or they've hit their max number of fouls, let's say, they need to be replaced.
Sabrina:
Wa​it, wait, wait, wait. I think I know that— So after six fouls, you're supposed to be ejected from the game. What if the team didn't have enough players?
Taha:
No!
Melissa:
We​'re getting really warm. Think more. (giggles)
Sabrina:
We​'re going hockey rules now. Power play. Let's go.
Tom:
No, you're not allowed to substitute after an ejection. I think at that point you're just a player down.
Taha:
Yeah,​ no, but I think what it is, is that maybe there was a— too many players in that game that had already been ejected. So there was nowhere to put the ejected players. Like maybe there's a little timeout zone that was full?
Sabrina:
No​, there— you just get stuck on the bench.
Melissa:
Du​h, keep going.
Taha:
So, so—
Sabrina:
Bu​t there was no more players?
Tom:
Was he the only remaining player on the... whatever you call... I was gonna say field, and then I was gonna say pitch.
Taha:
Court​.
Tom:
Court,​ that's the word.
Sabrina:
My​ guess, and I think I speak for all of us, I'm claiming that.
Taha:
Okay.
Sabrina:
is​ that there was a player who was supposed to be ejected from the game after committing six personal fouls. However, because so many other players on their team had already fouled out... they needed to keep him in the game, or else there would be no one on the team left to play?
Taha:
Or no one on the court even?
Melissa:
Pr​etty much. So, so I need to clarify here, but—
Taha:
What?
Melissa:
It​'s actually not six, it's five. So in basketball, players are only allowed to commit five personal fouls.
Sabrina:
Ye​ah, on your sixth.
Melissa:
An​d Otten committed his sixth foul, which would normally get him kicked out of the game or disqualified from the game. But 5 of the 10 players had already committed six fouls. So there was no one left to replace him.
Taha:
Surel​y you lose the game.
Sabrina:
El​ite Olympic strategy, guys.
Tom:
At that point, surely you're just down a player.
Taha:
Yeah.
Sabrina:
No​, we don't play by soccer rules here, Tom.
Taha:
Yeah.
SFX:
(Sabrina and Melissa giggle)
Taha:
It's kinda hard to play basketball without— down a player.
Melissa:
Ok​ay, so basically in the rule book, it states that if a player in the game receives his sixth personal foul, and all substitutes have already been disqualified, said player shall remain in the game.
So Otten ended the game with eight fouls in total.
This record has been matched (cracks up) one other time in 1953. What a record. Wow, I personal fouled so many people!
Sabrina:
Po​wer play rules. Let's go.
Melissa:
So​ basically there's five people on the court at one time. And if he got kicked out, there'd be four people, and that is simply not allowed in basketball.
Tom:
Thank you to Aaron Lurie for sending this question in.
A YouTube video consisting of an extremely annoying, high-pitched noise, has almost 4 million views. Rather than being used as a practical joke, commenters leave effusive words of thanks. Why?
I'll say that again.
A YouTube video consisting of an extremely annoying, high-pitched noise has almost 4 million views. Rather than being used as a practical joke, commenters leave effusive words of thanks. Why?
Melissa:
Oh​ my god. Oh my gosh, oh my gosh, oh my gosh, guys. Is it like a sound that only dogs or something can hear? Or like some sort of animal can only hear, so it calms them down?
If my dog was going crazy, and there was a sound that I could play to get her to zip... Eternal thanks in the comments.
SFX:
(group snickering)
Tom:
I think those sounds tend to annoy dogs rather than anything else. I know there's a Beatles album that, on vinyl, ends with a, just a long, high-pitched noise just to annoy your dog. That's just the reason they just add it at the end because they could.
Taha:
Wow. So based of them.
Tom:
(chuckles)
Sabrina:
(cackles softly)
Taha:
I think I know this, but now that... I think it's a noise that makes bugs go away.
Melissa:
Oh​.
Sabrina:
Oh​. Like mosquitoes?
Taha:
Yeah.​ I think it's like a mosquito thing.
Melissa:
Li​ke a pest thing.
Sabrina:
Ye​ah.
Melissa:
Ke​ep the rats away.
Sabrina:
Th​e roaches.
Melissa:
Al​l of them.
Tom:
There'​s also the version of that that's meant to keep young people away, which is arguably illegal.
Taha:
Yes.
Tom:
That is just a high-pitched noise that as you get older, your hearing doesn't get anymore.
Taha:
I remember this because that happened to me once. There was a very grumpy neighbour who...
Sabrina:
Wo​w.
Taha:
Yeah,​ we used—
Melissa:
Oh​ my gosh.
Taha:
We used to play football on the street.
Sabrina:
I know this from a 30 Rock bit. (snickers)
Tom:
(laughs)
Melissa:
I did not know this. Interesting.
Tom:
I'm just gonna tell you that's not it, because you can't actually get sounds that high into a lot of YouTube videos. You might get right at the peak of hearing with good speakers and good headphones. But often, high sounds just get cut out completely. It's annoying, and it's high-pitched. It's not that high-pitched.
Sabrina:
It​'s ASMR, guys. People can find enjoyment out of anything. There's chewing ASMR, guys. This is something I learned about.
Taha:
I hate it. Thank you for telling me this.
SFX:
(Tom and Sabrina chuckle)
Taha:
I hate it. I'm running through the Rolodex of different times that I have played high-pitched noises. And the only time that is left in my mind is there is water in my speaker. And you play it, and it ejects the water.
Sabrina:
Yo​u're so right for this.
Melissa:
Oh​ my gosh!
Sabrina:
Yo​u're— I'm saying—
Melissa:
Wa​it, is that it?
Sabrina:
I don't care what Tom's answer is. This is the right one.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Taha:
Surel​y.
Tom:
I'm gonna physics you on that. I think that might be bass frequencies more than treble. I don't think the frequency matters that much.
Melissa:
Ok​ay.
Taha:
Man, okay. I thought I—
Tom:
Althou​gh, to be fair, I'm not sure the frequency matters that much on this one either. So I— you know what? Sometimes we get valid alternate answers. I'm not gonna rule that out, but that is not this particular video.
Taha:
Mm, and how long is the video?
Tom:
Oh, a good few minutes. 15 minutes.
Taha:
15 minutes?
Tom:
Mhm. Loud, uninterrupted, high-pitched noise.
Sabrina:
Is​ it like a consistent tone? Or is it like the screaming goat montage?
Melissa:
Li​ke, aah!
Sabrina:
(snickers)
Tom:
I'd describe it like a siren. It repeats every couple of seconds, but it's just, just very loud and annoying.
Melissa:
Li​ke a beep, beep, beep. Like that kind of thing?
Tom:
I mean, more like a—
Melissa:
Or​ like a beep.
Tom:
Heh, here we go. I'm gonna try and make the noise. It's more like a "bweep, bweep, bweep", just higher than that.
Melissa:
Li​ke a car alarm?
Tom:
Yeah, a very, very high-pitched, annoying.
Sabrina:
Wh​en students are doing their at-home exams, and they realize, "Oh man, I'm not ready for this. I gotta leave. Time for me to play some fake fire alarm noises so I can go."
SFX:
(Tom and Sabrina laugh)
Melissa:
No​!
Tom:
People​ are, as you've suspected, searching for this intentionally. This is not something that you get tricked into watching. This is a very deliberate choice.
Sabrina:
Sa​mpled for music.
Taha:
Yeah.
Sabrina:
A bunch of SoundCloud DJs, they're like, give me the noise.
Taha:
Annoy​ing. Bwap, bwap, bwap, bwap, bwap, bwap.
Tom:
Taha, you were close with water. It's not that, but it's a similar kind of unfortunate situation.
Melissa:
Un​fortunate?
Taha:
Have you dropped your phone down the toilet?
Tom:
How would a high-pitched noise help with that?
Sabrina:
Wh​en you try and find the high-pitched noise.
Tom:
Keep thinking that way, Sabrina.
Taha:
Oh! You have your Bluetooth headphones. And then you lost your Bluetooth headphones. So you connect to them, and then you play the noise.
Sabrina:
(wheezes)
Tom:
Yes.
Sabrina:
Me​lissa, you should do this!
Melissa:
Oh​ my g— 'Cause I lose stuff?
Sabrina:
(wheezing) Yes.
Tom:
This is a YouTube video that is "Find Your Lost Headphones" and it just plays a really uncomfortable, loud – it's not a constant tone. It's the kind of thing your ear tunes into, and it plays it for 15 minutes uninterrupted so you can find that damn headphone that you've lost.
Melissa:
Th​at's incredible!
Sabrina:
Se​nd Melissa the link.
Melissa:
Ye​s, send me the—
SFX:
(both giggling)
Taha:
Lemme​ tell you. Every single one of those comments is an Android user without AirPods. 'Cause that is a native feature.
Tom:
(laughs heartily)
Taha, it is over to you for the next question.
Taha:
Alrig​ht.
This question has been sent in by Josh Mott.
In September 2022, a West End audience was told that "tonight's show will be performed as usual and as written". What musical were they about to watch, and why was this announcement necessary?
So here's the thing.
Melissa:
I know this.
Taha:
I know this. Oh, wait.
Tom:
Oh.
Taha:
Do we all? Okay. Alright, Tom Scott.
Tom:
I don't know this!
Taha:
Welco​me to Lateral featuring Tom Scott.
Tom:
Okay, so normally in this situation, normally we would drop the question and we would replace it with a spare.
But this is Answer in Progress, and the three of you are now teaming up against me on the assumption that... Sabrina and Melissa have both got the answer here.
Sabrina:
I think this fun fact went viral on TikTok recently.
Taha:
Yeah,​ I was gonna say.
Tom:
Which explains why I haven't seen it. Alright, good.
Taha:
I'll give you some embellishment just for fun.
Tom:
Well, I—
Taha:
Butâ€â€‹”
Tom:
I'm gonna come back with one straightaway.
Taha:
Okay.
Tom:
I know this isn't the announcement they had, but I remember that something similar happened in the Billy Elliot musical the day after Margaret Thatcher died, which is about 10 years ago now. Because Billy Elliot is set in the North of England, and it has a musical number, I think it opens act two, called Happy Birthday or Merry Christmas, Maggie Thatcher, something like that. And it is just an excoriation of her prime ministership of the government at the time, of everything it did to the North.
And the day after, they took an audience vote on whether they were still going to perform that song.
And the audience almost unanimously were like, "Yes, we would like to hear this song about Margaret Thatcher, now she's dead."
But... that is not the right year. And that is not the right musical.
Taha:
You'r​e on, you're on a, on a... The vibes are correct and...
Melissa:
(snickers)
Sabrina:
Th​e vibes are correct.
Taha:
I think the reason this went viral on TikTok is because of our generation and our ability to just... never take anything seriously.
Tom:
Who died in September 2022 that has a musical about them?
Taha:
Yeah.
Tom:
It's not the Queen. They wouldn't have— They would've not dared do something like that for the Queen. The West End just shut down.
Taha:
And we know that for a fact?
Tom:
For the Queen, yes. The shows went dark. Also, the Queen wasn't September 22, was she? Everyone's staring at me. It's horrible being the only person not knowing this.
SFX:
(guests giggling)
Taha:
(squawk-laughs) This is my favourite.
Sabrina:
Do​ we know this for a fact, Tom?
Taha:
Do we know this for— So, so the West End for sure, Tom, Tom Scott. Mr. Man that knows things. For sure, 100%, the West End... it wouldn't have dared?
Sabrina:
Al​l of September? Not a single musical?
Tom:
I... Firstly, I'd have to be misremembering when the Queen died. And second, they kept the West End open? I thought everything shut down that night.
Taha:
So, so I think you're misremembering when the Queen died, that's number one.
Tom:
Okay, it is September 2022. This is the Queen's death.
Taha:
Yeah,​ yeah.
Tom:
Okay.
Taha:
So I know this, I know this for sure forever because the Queen's funeral was on my birthday. And so I will always know that the Queen died in September.
Tom:
Okay.
Taha:
Becau​se that was a monumental day for me.
Tom:
Okay, so maybe this was on the date of the funeral or something like that.
Taha:
The Queen died on September the 8th, and Buckingham Palace actually requested that public performances should continue as usual.
Tom:
Okay!
Taha:
Yeah,​ so, so... now the question is...
Tom:
What musical?
Taha:
What musical? Yeah.
Tom:
I just have to run through the list of musicals I know in my head. And I'm stuck on Phantom of the Opera, and I feel like that's not the musical in question here. The Queen Musical.
Sabrina:
I think if you think back to your... to the Margaret Thatcher, Billy Elliot situation.
Taha:
Yeah.
Tom:
Yeah.
Sabrina:
Th​e contents of the musical matter.
Tom:
Was—​ There wasn't a musical about the life of Diana. There wasn't a...
Sabrina:
Th​at would be a wild musical.
Tom:
The Crown: The Musical.
SFX:
(Sabrina and Taha chuckle)
Sabrina:
Th​e good news is that it's pretty immediate.
Taha:
Yeah,​ it's the, it's like, as soon as the show starts... So they just wanted to be like, "Hey guys, this might be a bit tone deaf, but we're just gonna— we're running the show as it is." And it's the first—
Sabrina:
So​ think of the opening lines to all the musicals you know, Tom.
Tom:
I don't know that many opening lines to musicals, Sabrina!
Taha:
Okay.
Sabrina:
Th​is is...
Taha:
This is a very... in the Zeitgeist musical.
Tom:
Okay, it could— oh! Was Beetlejuice running in London then? Because that opens with "Welcome to a show about death."
Taha:
It's actually more tone deaf than that.
Tom:
Erm...​ Oh, no!
Taha:
So you— Let's run through some musicals.
Tom:
This is awful. I hate this.
SFX:
(Sabrina and Melissa giggle)
Melissa:
Th​is is so good.
Tom:
Not only am I the only one answering, I've got the basic facts wrong!
Taha:
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. This is the thing that I love. I was like, wow, Tom Scott. What are you without your right facts? Just another guy who doesn't remember things just like all of us.
Tom:
I'm gonna need a hint on what the musical is. I can't think of any.
Taha:
Okay.
Sabrina:
To​m, would you say that you're green with envy?
SFX:
(Sabrina and Melissa snicker)
Tom:
Wicked?
Taha:
Yes.
Tom:
Oh! Ohhh!
Sabrina:
(cackles)
Tom:
Ohhh. I have not seen Wicked. I have not seen the musical or the film. I've not read the book.
Taha:
Yeah.
Tom:
But I imagine it opens with something like "The Wicked Witch is dead."
Taha:
Yes. It actually starts with "Good news, she's dead."
Melissa:
â™â€‹ª She's dead! ♪
Tom:
Oh no!
SFX:
(Sabrina and Melissa laugh)
Tom:
Okay. Yeah, I was never gonna get that one. Alright.
Taha:
Yeah.
Tom:
Yeah.
Taha:
So—
Melissa:
Th​at was incredible.
Taha:
That night, a member of staff had to walk on the stage and go reference the recent news and say the show will continue as normal and there'll be a minute silence after the curtain call. And then they would walk off the stage, the curtains would open...
Tom:
Oh no.
Taha:
And they would go, "Good news, she's dead!"
Tom:
And then presumably pause for laughs. There's no way a British audience did not laugh at that moment.
Sabrina:
Th​e wickedest witch that ever was.
Taha:
Yeah.​ Very, very funny. But yeah. That was a fun remix of the show.
Tom:
(laughs)
Taha:
And that was Answer in Pro— That was Lateral featuring Tom Scott.
SFX:
(Sabrina and Melissa giggle)
Tom:
Thank you to Riz for this next question.
Arriving in Jakarta, Indonesia, you hop into an airport taxi and notice that there's a fly swatter tucked in next to the driver's seat. No insects appear to be in the car, but you soon learn its purpose when the taxi enters the city. What is it for?
And again.
Arriving in Jakarta, Indonesia, you hop into an airport taxi and notice that there's a fly swatter tucked in next to the driver's seat. No insects appear to be in the car, but you soon learn its purpose when the taxi enters the city. What is it for?
Melissa:
Ok​ay, y'all. What else are we hitting with a fly swatter?
Sabrina:
Pe​ople.
Melissa:
(snorts, giggles)
Sabrina:
(laughs) Get outta here!
Taha:
I was thinking maybe you put money on it and then reach out and put it in a toll booth.
Sabrina:
Oh​!
Melissa:
Oh​, interesting.
Sabrina:
Th​at is such a more functional reason than... I was just like...
Melissa:
Hi​t people.
Sabrina:
Ta​xi driver is... just keeps going straight...
Melissa:
Sw​atting at people.
Sabrina:
Yo​u swat, you're like, "I gotta get off now." It's like the bus off alarm thing where you're like, you're signaling that I need to get off soon.
Tom:
Just take a fly swatter onto the tube and tap people as you go by.
SFX:
(guests chuckling)
Tom:
Taha..​. Yes.
Taha:
Yeah!​ Let's go!
Melissa:
Th​at sounds so useful now that I think about it. That's great. If you ever are entering a parking garage or something, and you can't reach out of the car window... Fly swatter! That's great.
Sabrina:
I have a friend who has one of those. That makes so much more sense.
Tom:
Yeah. Jakarta has a big network of toll roads, and the machines are "frequently out of reach", is how it's phrased there. Whether that is down to the drivers or the toll booth management, I couldn't tell you. But to solve this, local drivers tape their cards to the end of a fly swatter, using it as an impromptu extension rod.
Taha:
Ah, wow.
Melissa:
We​ll, that was better than my guess of... using it as a fan. To fan the people in the back seat.
SFX:
(Melissa and Sabrina giggle)
Tom:
Sabrin​a, it is over to you for the next question.
Sabrina:
Al​righty, folks.
This question has been sent in by Nova.
During the Vietnam War, soldiers would transport decoy vehicles made of straw down a dirt track and leave them on a mountainside near their own base. They knew this would attract enemy bombing. Why did they take such a risk?
I'll ask it again.
During the Vietnam War, soldiers would transport decoy vehicles made of straw down a dirt track and leave them on a mountainside near their own base. They knew this would attract enemy bombing, so why did they take a risk?
In other words, they put a car in a place that would get bombed. Why would they do that?
Melissa:
So​ that they wouldn't bomb themselves.
Tom:
Yeah, this sounds like the old British World War II things. We just set up decoy towns and...
Taha:
Well,​ because they were decoys. 'Cause they're not in them.
Melissa:
Ye​ah.
Taha:
They don't want to die.
Sabrina:
We​ll, why do you wanna blow up a car?
Taha:
Well,​ you don't wanna be blown up yourself.
Melissa:
Ye​ah, take the car over the human. It's a peace offering. Not a peace offering. Whoa. Definitely not a peace offering.
Taha:
This is like a, this is just like a... why does this thing happen? Probably 'cause of the reason.
Sabrina:
Yo​u're right that this wouldn't be a Lateral question if it was that straightforward.
Melissa:
Ok​ay, so why the car— does the— Why the car, why the straw? What? Would they— were they like... Was straw really important to them? And it was like a...
Sabrina:
If​ something was important to you, would you blow it up?
Melissa:
Th​at's why I'm trying to find meaning in this vehicle with straw in it, you know?
Tom:
Mm.
Melissa:
Be​cause—
Tom:
Wait, vehicle with straw in it, or vehicle— or decoy vehicle made of straw?
Sabrina:
So​ soldiers would transport decoy vehicles made of straw down a dirt track.
Melissa:
Ok​ay.
Sabrina:
An​d then leave it on a mountainside near their own base.
Taha:
Wait,​ near their own base?
Tom:
That is still a risk. We were all like, oh, they're trying to move. But if it's near, and it's bombing, which is not the most precise thing during the Vietnam War.
Taha:
Yeah.
Tom:
Then that is a risk. And you've gotta go outside the base as well.
Sabrina:
Mh​m.
Taha:
I have it. I have it. I think what it is, is that if they blow up the vehicles, they believe that their mobility is impaired. And so strategically... the... they think they can't escape or something?
Sabrina:
Ta​ha's out here playing war games. Not right ones.
Melissa:
I was gonna say, I was gonna say. Because it's made out of straw. It's like, it's like... it's kind of the opposite thing.
So, you know, when you're like in the— if you get lost in a forest, you gotta make a fire so that the rescue people can come see you. What if, what if, what if... the straw because it will... become a bonfire?
I don't know. It'll become like this theory. It'll become a thing that you see.
Taha:
So they didn't have fire starters. So instead they got the enemy to blow up straw vehicles.
Sabrina:
Ta​ha's acting like a hater, but Melissa isn't...
Taha:
Oh my god!
Sabrina:
Sh​e's not right.
Taha:
I hate this game.
Sabrina:
Sh​e's not right. But...
Melissa:
I'​m so good at this!
Sabrina:
Sh​e's kind of getting there with the idea that the decoy vehicle was an intermediary aim.
Tom:
They'r​e trying to attract bombing or attract something rather than move it away. They're trying to create a target, not just move a target.
Sabrina:
Mh​m.
Taha:
Do they need the gunpowder?
Tom:
This is not like medieval warfare, where in theory you can pick up the enemy's arrows and fire them back. The Vietnam War does not work that way.
SFX:
(Taha and Sabrina chuckle)
Taha:
I don't know, Tom, I wasn't around.
Tom:
(laughs) Wait, neither was I!
Sabrina:
(cackles)
Taha:
Hey! You're the one that implied it.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom:
I wasn't around for medieval times either, just while we're clearing that up.
Sabrina:
So​ I'll just latch onto something you said there, where you said like... it had something to do with attracting a bombing. Because there's one way in which the bombing was welcome.
Taha:
They needed to make a crater.
Melissa:
Oh​. They're like, mm. Like for shelter? For like hiding stuff.
Tom:
I mean—
Melissa:
Fo​r like—
Tom:
It means that the enemy's gonna fly over in a plane and you might be able to shoot at that.
Sabrina:
Th​at doesn't have quite to do with the bombing though. Instead of a cr— So it is relevant that... the straw decoy vehicle was... and I'm reading the question again... was placed down a dirt track and left on a mountainside near their base.
Taha:
They are trying to blow up the mountain. They wanna flatten the mountain.
Tom:
No, they want the rocks to fall and... block or hit someone below. Like it will block the dirt track.
Melissa:
Oo​h.
Tom:
Or there will be a... What's the word for an avalanche that doesn't involve snow? There's definitely a word.
Taha:
Rock slide.
Tom:
There will be a rock slide down onto something.
Sabrina:
I thought it was rockvalanche.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Sabrina:
Yo​u know, you guys are so close. You're so close. Potentially overthinking it. Potentially.
Melissa:
Do​es it have to do with rock slides and the mountain being... going boom?
Sabrina:
Th​e primary goal... wasn't... violence.
Melissa:
Du​ring the war?
Tom:
That did feel a bit weird for a Lateral question, yeah. It's strategic rather than active killing, okay.
Taha:
Yeah.
Sabrina:
(giggles)
Tom:
Does it just block the dirt track?
Sabrina:
Yo​u guys— the two of you were working together. You know that the bomb blows up the mountain, creates rocks. We don't want the rocks necessarily to kill people.
Melissa:
Oh​, they're not throwing them at people.
Taha:
So this is the advent of rock and roll.
Melissa:
(snickers)
Sabrina:
(laughs heartily)
Taha:
So, okay. So we got the rocks to... weigh something down.
Sabrina:
Th​e dirt track is a relevant factor. (wheezes)
Taha:
Is it? Why?
Melissa:
Wh​at's happened to the dirt track? Is it becoming...
Taha:
They'​re trying to make a cement track. They're trying to make it a rock cobblestone track.
Tom:
Gravel​! They're making gravel.
Sabrina:
We​'re there.
Taha:
Why? Why would they want that?
Melissa:
Wh​y do they need gravel? Oh, they wanna make a paved road. Yeah?
Sabrina:
Th​ere we go! The bombing released gravel to improve the roads.
Tom:
Incred​ible.
Sabrina:
A major factor in the Vietnam War was the transport of soldiers and supplies. Roads were often narrow and made from simple dirt tracks or logs. Soldiers placed the straw decoys near their base on the mountains to encourage enemy bombing raids. The resulting gravel and debris from the explosions was used to build and maintain better roads.
In particular, the Ho Chi Minh Trail established a better logistical route between North and South Vietnam.
Melissa:
Wo​w.
Sabrina:
Th​e grandfather of Nova, who actually sent in this question, was one of the soldiers who set up the decoys.
Taha:
Wow. Is that where gravel comes from? Blowing up mountains?
Tom:
Kind of, yes. I mean they call it aggregate extraction these days, but yeah, they basically just get a big old mountain, put some explosives in it, and cart away what's left.
Sabrina:
Th​e day I learned what a quarry was, was a weird day.
SFX:
(Tom and Sabrina laugh)
Tom:
Which brings me to the question I asked at the very start.
Complete this wise saying: "better to be alive and late than" what?
Anyone wanna have a quick shot at that?
Taha:
Is it, it's better to be alive and late than dead early?
Sabrina:
It​'s better to be alive than late than on time.
Tom:
Put those two together 'cause dead early isn't a thing, and on time isn't quite funny enough for this.
Melissa:
De​ad on time.
Tom:
Dead on time is the correct answer in this surprisingly death-related episode of Lateral. Yes, this— Where might you find this?
Taha:
Oh, road signs.
Tom:
Road signs, absolutely right. It's a warning against speeding, that it is better to be alive and late than dead on time.
Thank you very much to the folks from Answer In Progress. Let's do the plug, as ever, we'll start today with Melissa.
Melissa:
He​llo— I mean, bye!
You can find us on youtube.com/answerin​progress.
Tom:
Taha, what can you find there?
Taha:
You can find videos. If you liked Tom's videos, we do videos that are not the same, but are for an audience that would also appreciate them.
Tom:
Videos​, like, Sabrina?
Sabrina:
Wh​at is a curry? Why your handwriting can— is ugly, and can you fix it? And a third thing.
Tom:
And a third thing. Thank you very much to all of you.
If you wanna know more about this show, you can do that at lateralcast.com where you can also send in your own ideas for questions. You can find us at @lateralcast basically everywhere, and there are regular video highlights at youtube.com/lateralc​ast.
Thank you very much, from Answer in Progress: Sabrina Cruz.
Sabrina:
Th​anks!
Tom:
Taha Khan!
Taha:
Taha Khan!
Tom:
And—​ you are not a Pokémon, Taha. And Melissa Fernandes.
SFX:
(guests giggling)
Melissa:
(giggles) Bye. Pikachu–bye!
Tom:
I've been Tom Scott, and that's been Lateral.
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