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Episode 152: Microwaving chocolate
5th September, 2025 • Ruth Amos, Evan Edinger and Abby Cox face questions about sneaky stickers, fat fingers and banished beetles.
Transcription by Caption+
Tom:
A hotel has a Booking.com sticker in their window that is purposefully upside down. Why? The answer to that at the end of the show. My name's Tom Scott, and this is Lateral. Welcome to the show with questions that have a lot in common with bananas. They're both bendy, slippery in places, and slightly radioactive. So if a guest seems to glow when they get something right... it might just be the potassium isotopes. Hoping to prove that they are the pick of the bunch, first we have from his own YouTube channel and from across the Atlantic, Evan Edinger, welcome back.
Evan:
Hello. I'm now across the Atlantic.
Tom:
Always a joy to have you here. Look, you never give me a decent... You could list off multi-hyphenate stuff. You could list off what you've been comparing recently. This video is gonna come out months ahead of when we record it. Evan, how would you like to be known to the world?
Evan:
I'm an American–British man who likes too many things and has too many niches and loves it all. So, words and language and just interesting differences between countries.
Abby:
Are you Thomas Jefferson?
Evan:
Yeah, actually I am. How did you know?
SFX:
(group laughing)
Evan:
I'm on the nickel.
Tom:
He spent some time in France, and then he came back and helped the revolution. That's— yeah.
Evan:
He actually wasn't the nicest guy, so I'd rather not be.
Abby:
No, no.
Tom:
That is –
Evan:
But thank you.
Tom:
all I know about Thomas Jefferson, but eh, I think I held my own. Oh, is there some bad history with Thomas Jefferson?
Evan:
Oh yeah, I could send you a podcast after. He was not just an awful man with slavery, but...
Tom:
We'll...
Abby:
Yeah.
Tom:
Evan, I apologise to you. You are not Thomas Jefferson.
Abby:
I'm the one who asked, and it was mostly just a joke. Because Thomas Jefferson loved books and reading and...
Evan:
Yeah.
Abby:
was super nerdy and into all sorts of different things, and I wasn't...
Tom:
(laughs) You wasn't implying that Evan owned people. That's probably for the best.
Abby:
(laughs) No! It was more just like, what, 18th century nerd.
Tom:
Living up to her previous description on this podcast of unhinged history and culture...
SFX:
(Abby and Evan giggle)
Tom:
Archiv— Was it archivist, commentator? I can't remember. Abby Cox, welcome back to the show.
Abby:
Hi! (laughs)
Tom:
(laughs)
Abby:
Great to be here. Accidentally insulting Evan on accident. Just trying to make a joke. Don't worry. My social anxiety will wake me up at 3 am, and I'll be mortified.
Tom:
(chortles)
Abby:
(laughs heartily)
Evan:
I'll never stop thinking about this.
Abby:
Sorry, Evan!
Tom:
I'd like to think this was all in good spirits.
Abby:
Yes.
Tom:
But what have you been working on, Abby? What's in the pipeline right now? 'Cause this is gonna come out a few months ahead.
Abby:
Yeah. Oh gosh. It's probably videos. Depending on where this comes out, maybe my book manuscript has been turned in.
Tom:
Mm.
Abby:
Fingers crossed.
Tom:
Can you say what you are writing about yet?
Abby:
I've been working on a book about women's corsetry. And basically the woman's... the feminine lived experience through her corset and using sources that were written by women for women to tell the story. Because so often when we talk about corsetry, we actually center men's opinions on the corset and...
Tom:
Both Evan and I are really resisting making a joke right now. I can see it on his face.
Abby:
It's okay.
Tom:
It's like, there's— He's already been compared to Thomas Jefferson. Let's not make it worse for him.
Evan:
Of corset makes sense for that.
Abby:
Of course it does!
Evan:
Of corset.
Tom:
Well, good luck to you on the show today, Abby. The third member of our crew, who has been remarkably quiet so far, (laughs) as the two Americans have—
Ruth:
I don't think I can— I don't have enough American history to join in with this banter without massively offending someone. So I'm just staying very quiet in the corner.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Evan:
(moans)
Tom:
Ruth Amos from Kids Invent Stuff. Welcome back to the show. How are you doing?
Ruth:
Thanks for having me. I'm doing great. Yeah!
Tom:
Tell me about the workshop you're in. 'Cause there is a lot of stuff behind you right now.
Ruth:
Yeah, it is slightly chaotic in here. It does need a tidy up, but yes. It's not a very big space. It's 3.8m x 3.8m, but I do cram it with stuff. We have been doing lots of... live events and shows at the moment. So we've been building backdrops as well as kids' invention ideas. So yeah, it's just very chaotic. Very chaotic here.
Tom:
You got a Guinness World Record, I believe, since we last talked on the show.
Ruth:
Do you know what, Tom? Actually, I've got two.
Tom:
Oh, oh?
Ruth:
So, you know. Yeah, I know. Tell me about it. Yes.
Tom:
I know you had world's biggest toothbrush.
Ruth:
So you got world's biggest toothbrush. And then the second one that we got is we did a live show where everyone made and fired confetti cannons, that fired popcorn, actually, popcorn cannons. And so we got a world record for that. And I think when this comes out, we will either be asking for or have asked for kids' invention ideas for world records.
Tom:
Oh, lovely.
Ruth:
So the plan is to build a kid's world record. So yeah.
Tom:
Very best of luck to you on that and with the show today. Before you all go bananas, it's time to enjoy the fruit of the question team's labours as we unpeel question one. This question has been sent in by David Lyford-Tilley. Ian rings a phone number. Half an hour later, someone arrives at his house and hands him a voucher for a takeaway. Why was this important? I'll say that again. Ian rings a phone number. Half an hour later, someone arrives at his house and hands him a voucher for a takeaway. Why was this important? And just to translate that for the folks across the Atlantic: Hands him a voucher for takeout.
Evan:
Hands him a coupon.
Tom:
Oh yeah, sorry.
Abby:
A coopin'.
Tom:
A coupon for takeout.
Evan:
First off, coupon. Thank you. Secondly, takeout or delivery, yeah.
Abby:
It's a coopin'.
Evan:
So, maybe it's, so sometimes when you get food deliveries I find that... either food just doesn't arrive, or the guy gets hungry and eats it. So he's like, "Here's a coupon. You can have it next time for free."
Ruth:
I ate your food. Sorry.
Tom:
(chuckles)
Ruth:
My— The worst thing is when you get food delivered and they forget something. So you're like, hang on. And then there's not a real person to talk to, 'cause it's done through an app. So you just have to... complain to an AI robot, and then yeah. But all you want is your burger. That's all you want.
Abby:
See, I don't like having stuff delivered 'cause it's always cold, so I just never do it.
Tom:
This does seem to be an American thing.
Evan:
I've been literally burnt from takeaway before, so that's why I'm surprised.
Abby:
That's why that must be nice because usually I get it and it's like... Ew.
Evan:
Eh.
Abby:
My value to this is like, well, obviously it's important because he was hungry, but he didn't get food. So that's sad. And I feel bad.
Evan:
So Ian gets a voucher after 30 minutes?
Tom:
Yes.
Abby:
Oh. Oh, it didn't get delivered on time.
Tom:
Ian rings a phone number, and half an hour later, someone arrives at his house, gives him the voucher.
Evan:
Nobody rings phone numbers these days. It's 2025.
Tom:
Mm.
Ruth:
But I don't think it was. I think it must have been... So, was there a fast food restaurant that did a thing when they launched, that if they didn't deliver in a certain time, you got the meal for free or something?
Evan:
That was Domino's.
Tom:
It was, and they had to cancel the promotion after delivery drivers kept dying in car crashes.
Evan:
Yeah. What if you happen to be reading the terms and conditions, right? And you scroll to the bottom, 'cause this is what you do for— just for fun. And you see something that says, if you call this number, you can get a free voucher for pizza. And you're like, well, I might as well. And then he called the number.
Abby:
But you do get that if you do a survey.
Evan:
Mhm.
Ruth:
Or maybe he didn't order the— Yeah, maybe he didn't order the takeaway. Maybe he did something else. Maybe he...
Evan:
That's something.
Ruth:
won it on a live show. Maybe it was back like, Saturday Night Takeaway. Without a doubt. It's a very British reference here.
Tom:
Oh, I get the reference. They've done stuff like that before. They've gotten in trouble for stuff like that before. There was a national competition they did, where you called in on a premium rate phone number, and they would pick someone and send the camera van to your house by the end of the show.
Evan:
Woah!
Tom:
Except— Well, yes. The trouble was they knew where the camera van was, and they had to pick a house within the radius of that van. So if you happened to be outside that radius, you had no way of winning. And that it turns out, got some complaints.
Evan:
That's fair.
Tom:
You are correct, Ruth, that this was not the phone number for the takeaway.
Ruth:
Oh, okay.
Tom:
He was doing something else. That phone number was about something else.
Abby:
Okay. But not a survey. So not answering questions?
Tom:
No, someone turned up after only half an hour.
Abby:
Filing a complaint.
Tom:
Why would someone turn up after only half an hour for something like that?
Ruth:
Was the food really bad? And they called the health... people, inspector people, and was like, the food's terrible, and they came with a voucher.
Tom:
No, that phone number really has nothing to do with food. That's not why you'd call it. It's more related to an emergency.
Ruth:
Is it like... So if you're diabetic, and you have a high— But the voucher would be useless. I'm thinking like if, you had a medical emergency, and you needed... voucher for takeaway. Is it like, oh, did he— Okay, so he's wandering along, and outside his house are two orphan children. He doesn't know they're orphans, but essentially there's two children, and he calls the police, and they're like, you need to feed them. And he is like, I don't have any money. And so they send someone with a voucher.
Tom:
The voucher is kind of secondary. This is not one of the typical emergency services.
Ruth:
Sorry. No, it's not one of the typical, so we've got police, fire... Coast Guard.
Tom:
Yep.
Ruth:
Ambulance.
Evan:
Paramedics.
Tom:
Yep.
Ruth:
Prison wardens?
Abby:
Is it a gas leak? And so there's a gas leak, and the person can't cook, and so they call the gas, and they give him a voucher for food?
Tom:
Absolutely right, Abby! Out of nowhere!
Ruth:
Genius.
Evan:
(applauds)
Tom:
Talk us through it. What's the situation here?
Abby:
I was just thinking the fact that my mother is currently without gas, because she has a leak and she is like...
Tom:
Did someone turn up and give her a compensation voucher?
Abby:
No, because this is America!
SFX:
(both laugh heartily)
Abby:
She instead was told that she would have to... It's a very long story, and it's just awful. Anyways, she's been complaining this whole time, and my mom's an hour and a half away, and I'm like, I don't know what to do. I'm sorry, but I know that if she had called the gas company and said, "I'm out of gas. I cannot cook..." And they delivered a food voucher, it would make her life so much better.
Tom:
Yes, this is the gas emergency number. If you smell gas, there is a number to call. They will send someone out as quickly as they can for obvious reasons. And if they then have to cut off your gas supply, you may, it's not guaranteed, but you may get a voucher for delivery food to make up for it while they fix the leak.
Abby:
That's nice. That's really nice.
Tom:
Partly, that's compensation. There is one other reason that they might give that voucher. And it's for safety.
Abby:
So you don't try to turn the oven on?
Ruth:
Yes, he's not tempted to switch on.
Tom:
Yeah. So you don't go out and reconnect the gas so you can cook. Absolutely right. Ruth, it is over to you for this question.
Ruth:
So this question has been sent in by Nick. When filming an exterior scene for Breaking Bad, the crew were having difficulties completing a take successfully. After several failed attempts, they solved the problem by swapping two words around. Which two, and why? When filming an exterior scene for Breaking Bad, the crew were having difficulty completing a take successfully. After several failed attempts, they solved the problem by swapping two words around. Which two, and why?
Evan:
Bad Breaking. Not the name of the TV show. It's Breaking Bad. Sorted. No. Hmm.
Tom:
I've never seen Breaking Bad. I've only got what I've
Evan:
Tom, what?
Tom:
picked up through osmosis. So if someone could clue me in on details here, that would be appreciated.
Evan:
It's just a science teacher who likes making science.
Tom:
I know it's a chemistry teacher...
Abby:
It's a very American science.
Tom:
Right. Yeah.
Abby:
(laughs)
Evan:
So there's two words that are swapped in an exterior scene. I'm wondering if they're spoken by Walter White, or if they're spoken by one of the more Hispanic actors. Maybe there's a certain word that's... word pairing that's difficult for them.
Tom:
Exterior scene's gotta be important though. Because the load of exterior scenes that get interrupted by things like planes flying over or the public in the background or something like that. If you're not filming on a soundstage, there's gonna be something outside their control.
Abby:
I wonder if it's like, if there was construction going on, and people were yelling "cut" like they were cutting a line? And so, camera people would hear someone yelling "cut", and then they would cut the camera, the filming, thinking that it was the director, and instead it was, you know, someone working on a water or gas line?
Tom:
And then obviously they had to give out compensation vouchers to everyone nearby as they cut the gas line off.
Abby:
Yes, yes, yes.
Evan:
Hmm.
Abby:
Absolutely.
Evan:
I'm— so I'm— I guess the angle would be, is it something to do with the outside environment, rather than something to do with linguistic hurdles? I feel like the outside environment now makes more sense.
Ruth:
Yeah, outside environment. I think between Abby and Tom, you're heading in a good direction.
Abby:
So the script had it written one way, and then they had to reverse words.
Tom:
Which means they can acknowledge the thing that's going on instead of having to try and wait until it stops or gets outta their way, I'd guess.
Ruth:
The words aren't actually part of the script dialogue.
Tom:
Oh, okay.
Evan:
So this isn't in the script. It's just two words. In general, so that makes way more sense. Okay.
Abby:
And it wasn't the actors. It was the crew.
Evan:
Correct. It's not like White Walter.
Tom:
So what's going on outside they're having trouble with?
Abby:
So we— Let's see. Outside filming in that neighborhood. So it was like a suburban neighborhood, depending on where they're filming, right? It's in New Mexico. So we have utility works, we have street work, you know, paving, road work, there's school buses, there's—
Tom:
There's weather anywhere.
Evan:
Nah, there's no weather in New Mexico.
Tom:
Fair.
SFX:
(Tom and Evan chuckle)
Abby:
What I've seen of the show too, especially, I think, 'cause I think it takes place in Albuquerque. It's very sunny. It's a desert area. It's hot. So it's like... unless it was weird weather happening when filming, but, and I've never finished Breaking Bad, because I— it got too dark for me.
Tom:
It could also be too dark, literally in that night is falling or something like that is, that's affecting their shot.
Abby:
Yeah. I'm just trying to think of, if, I mean... When it comes to crew communication. What words would they need to flip around in order to—
Tom:
Okay, well, the obvious ones are lights, camera, action. But...
Abby:
Yeah, rolling.
Tom:
That's not really what gets called on professional film sets these days. 'Cause the lights don't need to get turned on immediately before the camera starts.
Abby:
Yeah, so it's like cut, rolling.
Tom:
Yeah.
Evan:
What's the word they call extras these days that's less offensive to them?
Tom:
(laughs softly)
Ruth:
So you're heading in the right direction. At the beginning, Abby said one of the words, and then you kind of detoured off again. And then Tom, you said one of the words again. So you're heading in the right direction.
Abby:
The first one I ever thought of was 'cut', 'cause I was thinking of utility work and cutting.
Ruth:
Yep.
Abby:
'Cause we made the reference about the gas. Then I said 'rolling'.
Ruth:
(shakes head)
Abby:
And then... So cut's the only one that...
Ruth:
Yeah, so you— Cut's one of them.
Abby:
Okay, cut's one of them.
Ruth:
So cut is the first word. What might come before that?
Abby:
Action?
Ruth:
Yes. Okay, so they're the two words. Action and cut. So, why might they be swapped?
Abby:
Because if you say action–cut, then you start–stop. And if you say cut–action, you stop–start.
Ruth:
It's more about what other people around them might be doing. So if you say action, what usually happens on a film set?
Abby:
People act.
Evan:
Everyone starts acting.
Ruth:
Yeah, and what might stop— might— What might be a problem if people are acting, and you're trying to get seen?
Tom:
Oh! Oh, I've seen this done! I've seen this done. And it's a... They're filming in public, right?
Ruth:
They are.
Evan:
So someone kept interrupting the shots.
Ruth:
Evan literally said it almost word for word. So, so... The two words that were swapped were 'action' and 'cut', and it was to fool a neighbour that was interrupting them. So, season one, episode five, "Gray Matter", was partly filmed on a patio outside a real home in a residential neighbourhood, and a disgruntled neighbour annoyed at production sought to ruin the shots by doing yard work and started up his wood chipper every time the director called "action" and he then shut it off when he heard "cut". So production told the cast and crew to swap them 'round. And so "action" meant stop, and "cut" meant go.
Tom:
So the place I've seen that before was a... news gatherer. Journalist, that's the word. Journalist, sorry, "news gatherer"(!) Someone with a camera trying to get just a nice calm, just people walking in the street shot. And people just weren't behaving naturally, because like, "Oh, there's a camera on me. I'm gonna line up for this camera, we get it." So what he did was he just kind of said, "Alright, cut, we're done." And just kind of held it by his side, and everyone just went back to being normal. And that was the shot that made it into the final piece.
Ruth:
Yeah, weirdly, after this incident, the homeowners association for this neighbourhood banned use of any properties for being used for sets in the future.
Tom:
Yeah.
Ruth:
But yeah.
Evan:
Oh, but it made it feel so real.
Ruth:
No.
SFX:
(Tom and Ruth laugh)
Tom:
Thank you to Jackson Conte for sending in this question. Once a year, Kelly microwaves a bar of chocolate. What's her job, and what is this procedure for? I'll say that again. Once a year, Kelly microwaves a bar of chocolate. What's her job, and what is this procedure for?
Evan:
It's once a year, so only every once in a while. You'd wanna pipe chocolate onto something?
Abby:
Is it like Valentine's Day? Or Christmas?
Ruth:
Ooh. There's so many chocolate holidays.
Abby:
Yeah. But so Christmas, especially in the United States, people will melt chocolate chips or Hershey's Kisses or something. 'Cause they microwave really easily and melt down easily without getting really messy. And you can dump pretzels in them and sprinkle sprinkles on them. Or hundred-thousands, what do you guys call them, and, or whatever. And you give them out as presents and... It's like homemade candy.
Tom:
I thought you had to use a double boiler.
Abby:
No, you don't have to.
Tom:
No? Okay.
Evan:
Hershey's is actually famously created specifically to not be easy to melt compared to real chocolate.
Abby:
Well, it just said chocolate bar, but... We can do that here. That's how, especially Kisses, Nestle's...
Evan:
Yeah.
Abby:
It's either dunking strawberries for Valentine's Day... or making homemade sweets for Christmas to give out as gifts.
Ruth:
But it's her job. What job would involve—
Abby:
I mean, holiday prep is a job, let's be honest.
Tom:
(laughs)
Ruth:
We've been undervaluing (laughs) the labour of... putting that microwaved chocolate bar in.
Abby:
But if you're at a restaurant or something, right? And then you have a special...
Ruth:
Yeah, but it's one bar, right? One bar?
Tom:
One bar of chocolate once a year. And it does have to be a bar.
Ruth:
If you're melting it, why does it have to be a bar?
Tom:
She also has to remove the turntable first.
Ruth:
Is it some weird health and safety thing? So, they make microwaves, someone could put the whole bar in with the foil wrapper... Like... "Let's test it." And every year, they test that, and that's their job. And she goes, "Little point. Well done."
Tom:
I think the strongest part of that was you saying, "Little point. Well done."
Ruth:
Ooh.
Abby:
(cackles softly) It's— So— Ooh. Is it a school test? Educational thing?
Tom:
It is an educational thing, yes.
Abby:
Yeah. Okay. So are we talk— Now, the question then is, is this a educational, home ec, high school, middle school type of education? Or are we talking, you know, chef school, pastry school type of situation? So more like, welcome, here's how to crack an egg. Kids, please don't—
Evan:
Well, it's only once a year.
Abby:
Yeah, so it's a final exam or something. Or it's one part of a course in a semester.
Tom:
Yes. Correct. Correct with that, Abby. Yes. That's why it's once a year.
Abby:
So it's an exam?
Tom:
Once a year, part of the syllabus is this.
Abby:
And it's obviously food related or some sort of... science related thing.
Tom:
Is it?
Ruth:
Is it not food?
Abby:
Or science related?
Tom:
More in science.
Abby:
More in science.
Tom:
Than food, I'd say.
Abby:
Okay.
Ruth:
Is it to do with, she puts it in the microwave to show the children the crystallisation of chocolate, and why you should always melt chocolate properly because the crystals don't form back and it goes white and grim?
Abby:
Unless you're an American, and you have the correct chocolate to do it at home.
Tom:
Everything up to "show the children", absolutely right. But that's the wrong... sort of lesson. That's the wrong subject. It is not actually to do with the chocolate itself. She actually only wants part of the chocolate melted.
Ruth:
Is it to do with the fact that the way the microwave cooks, if the turntable isn't in, you can melt the centre of the bar without the rest of the bar being melted?
Tom:
Yyyy—oooh. What do you mean by centre of the bar?
Ruth:
Well, essentially the way that the rays... I'm trying to remember how a microwave works, but the way that the microwave works means that... part of the spinning turntable is to make sure that you evenly cook food. So if you took that out, you could show, scientifically... what the microwave does, because part of the chocolate will be melted and part wooden, I think.
Tom:
Yes. This is to do with the hotspots in the microwave. You're spot on. That's why the turntable exists. That's why you sometimes get hot and cold spots in there. What might be the next step in that demonstration?
Ruth:
You open the chocolate bar, and bits of it are melty.
Tom:
Yes. Bits of it are. Bits of it aren't. There's something you can work out from that. And I suspect this is a demonstration that is popular in schools now and probably wasn't when most of us were growing up. It's become popular.
Ruth:
Does that mean it's do with climate change? 'Cause no one cared about climate change when I was at school.
SFX:
(Tom and Abby laugh)
Tom:
it's a TikTok actually. No, this is measuring a famous constant. Planck's got nothing to do with it.
Ruth:
(giggles)
Abby:
I study old clothes.
Evan:
I st— I liked mechanical engineering and electrical engineering and then that's where I bailed out at that point.
Tom:
I think from electrical engineering, Evan, you might be able to work this one out.
Evan:
I said my Plancks.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Evan:
I'm out. Uh, hmm.
Tom:
You have a microwave and its specifications. And you have this bar of chocolate, which actually probably doesn't have –
Evan:
Energy output?
Tom:
one melted point in the centre. It has a couple of melted points at the hotspot areas.
Evan:
So does the wattage of the microwave have any effect here on the experiment?
Tom:
The frequency of the microwave.
Ruth:
Ooh, can you...
Evan:
Oh.
Ruth:
Can you work out the wavelength of something? Or the...
Tom:
So yes. With a ruler, you can work out the wavelength of the microwaves. And that, with a bit of physics, means you can work out something else.
Abby:
Can you measure the hotspots to the non-hotspots and somehow calculate the... with that? With how they are on the bar?
Tom:
Yep.
Abby:
The size of the bar?
Tom:
The distance between the hotspots makes a big difference here. That is a really important thing. You combine that with some data from how the microwave works. You can work out something fundamental.
Ruth:
How quickly you could... cook something.
Tom:
How quickly is... How quick, perhaps.
Ruth:
How... would cook something? (laughs)
Tom:
Perhaps more, how fast. It's something that's very quick indeed.
Evan:
The speed of light.
Tom:
You're absolutely right, Evan. This is a high school physics demonstration to work out the speed of light.
Ruth:
Tell us how to do it at home!
Tom:
You melt the chocolate until parts of it are just melting. You measure the distance from one melted point to the next one. You double it. That gives you the wavelength of the microwaves that are used by that microwave. The frequency is gonna be on the spec sheet. You can do maths to that, and that will give you something very close to the speed of light, depending on how accurate your ruler is, you can actually get it to—
Ruth:
And how long you left it melting for.
Tom:
Yeah. And how accurate those little points are, to within a couple of percent. A high school student can work out the value of the speed of light by melting a chocolate bar in a microwave.
Evan:
We did have a thing where we had to build a parabola that was made out of Mylar reflective material. And then on a hot sunny day, we put a hot dog in the fulcrum in the middle, so we could make a solar powered hot dog roaster. That was similar, I guess.
SFX:
(Tom and Abby laugh)
Tom:
Abby, the next question is yours.
Abby:
Okay. This question has been sent by Madison M. Mount Hope Cemetery in Rochester, New York sometimes puts a plexiglass cover over one of its gravestones. This is to protect it from damage caused by adhesive. Why? Again. Mount Hope Cemetery in Rochester, New York sometimes puts a plexiglass cover over one of its gravestones. This is to protect it from damage caused by adhesive. Why?
Ruth:
Okay, so... A long time ago, there was a magician and his dog. And people loved the dog so much that when it died, they come to this cemetery, and they glue on balloon animals shaped like said dog. And that's what they're protecting it from.
Abby:
This is so funny. Just... So you're headed in the right direction.
Ruth:
Yes!
Tom:
(laughs uproariously)
Abby:
But it has nothing to do with a magician and a dog.
Tom:
That's how this show works!
Evan:
(nonplussed) Mhm.
Abby:
(laughs heartily) It's like, keep going with that. But...
Ruth:
But don't.
Abby:
Not as whimsical.
Ruth:
Keep going, but don't.
Abby:
Just not as whimsical!
Tom:
I was thinking super-glue protests, but that's because I watched something on the Just Stop Oil protesters who have been super-gluing themselves to stuff, and... I don't know why you'd do that to a gravestone. That's not particularly disruptive.
Evan:
I was thinking of stamps for some dumb reason.
Abby:
Again, since we're laterally thinking here, right? Protesting absolutely is related to why...
Tom:
Wow.
Abby:
there is adhesive involved. But it's not necessarily an act of protest at that moment.
Tom:
I thought it might be the inventor of some sort of adhesive. And people are paying tribute by gluing things to the gravestone?
Evan:
So, it was a Buddhist that died there, and he has the little Buddhist symbol on it. However, it kinda looks like a swastika. So people kind of protest that, thinking that is a swastika when it— no.
Abby:
No. I also would... It's not a man.
Tom:
Oh, okay.
Ruth:
We honestly, we keep throwing these men in. And it's all these women, isn't it? Do you know what I mean?
Evan:
I don't like assuming women are dead. So, you know.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
Alright, Thomas Jefferson(!)
Abby:
Okay, so this is— Okay, I'll give you guys another hint. This person is someone that... I would know a decent amount about.
Tom:
Ooh, okay.
Evan:
Andrew Jackson.
Abby:
Ew, gross.
Ruth:
Marilyn Monroe.
Abby:
She's not in New York.
Ruth:
Oh.
Abby:
The leap— I almost said, when was a woman, it's not Marilyn. Just so that way we could be like, it's not Marilyn. Her gravestone actually is vandalized by lipstick kisses. There's usually red lipstick on hers.
Evan:
Ew, that's grim.
Abby:
Oh, she— oh— This is a side quest, but there was a rich guy who bought the one above her.
Ruth:
Yes!
Abby:
And he was buried—
Evan:
Oh yeah.
Tom:
Yes.
Evan:
It's just disrespected. Well that's the famous guy that started the Playboy, isn't it?
Tom:
Yeah, that's Hugh Hefner, I think.
Evan:
Hugh Hefner.
Abby:
I don't think it's— Is it Hugh?
Tom:
I'm pretty sure—
Evan:
I believe that is the stat, yeah.
Abby:
Okay.
Tom:
I mean, good news. I think he's dead, and you can't libel the dead. So let's just go with, it's Hugh Hefner.
Ruth:
(snickers)
Abby:
Yeah. So, yeah, it's not Marilyn, even though, but— Oh, oh, oh, okay. So to circle it back to Marilyn... It's the same sort of vibe and energy, if that makes sense. Because it's like—
Tom:
Alright, it's an ill-advised tribute.
Abby:
Yes.
Tom:
We are gluing a thing to this gravestone. Because in life, she... Help me out here.
Abby:
Remember, protesting, this— Protesting was involved with this thing.
Tom:
One of the suffragettes? I don't know if there was an American branch, if you like, of the suffragettes. I assume there was a similar movement.
Abby:
Oh yeah, oh yeah, oh yeah.
Tom:
Okay.
Evan:
Oh yeah, we learned about that.
Abby:
So actually, in a hat pin video, I give an account about... they were like... One of the accounts I was given of these women were protesting in DC, and they were being followed by men. And the girls whipped out their hat pins to keep them away to protect their freedom of speech and their right to assemble, to protest for their right to vote. So yes, this is absolutely has to do with the suffragist movement.
Tom:
Did she famously glue herself to something as protest?
Abby:
No, no.
Tom:
Agh!
Abby:
I'm gonna say again, this is probably something that Evan will get. You guys, probably, British people probably won't get. Because there's always something that happens when voting occurs.
Evan:
Law and order.
Abby:
Dun-dun.
Ruth:
(laughs)
Evan:
Dun-du— Damn. Um, hm. I did vote recently. Didn't work.
Abby:
Yeah, now granted, you didn't get to go vote in person, I assume.
Evan:
I did, I actually flew over to New Jersey just to vote. I got a sticker. It's in my house still, actually.
Ruth:
Oh, you get a sticker!
Evan:
I have a sticker.
Ruth:
Oh, do people put stickers?
Tom:
The "I voted" stickers!
Abby:
Yes!
Ruth:
They put a sticker!
Abby:
Who gets the sticker on her gravestone?
Evan:
Hillary Clinton.
Abby:
No! She's not dead!
SFX:
(group laughing)
Evan:
Alright. Famous women who are dead.
Abby:
Here's a fun fact. She was on a dollar for a while. A dollar coin. I know we had dollar coins.
Evan:
Susan B. Anthony.
Abby:
Yes!
Evan:
Susan B. Anthony. She's on a silver pound coin. Pound. I'm already too British.
SFX:
(others laugh uproariously)
Evan:
Wow.
Tom:
Evan...
Evan:
Silver dollar coin.
Tom:
I know the name, but I do not know who Susan B. Anthony was.
Evan:
Susan B. Anthony used to be on the dollar coin, a silver coin. She's a famous suffragette. Coincidentally, I believe she's buried in Rochester, New York.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Abby:
Fun fact.
Evan:
I have— I literally couldn't tell you much, except I know her from the currency and...
Tom:
And when you vote in America, you are often given a little "I voted" sticker.
Abby:
And so women will go... in that area, will go to her gravestone, and put their "I voted" sticker on. Because she was one of the first push— encouragers of the suffragist movement in the United States. She was not a— I don't know when Susan B. Anthony died. Because we got the right to vote in 1920, is when that passed. But she was alive in the mid-1900— mid-1800s. So she was also just a part of the dress reform movement, women's rights movements. She, I actually literally was just writing about something that she was a part of with the bloomer costume in 1851. And she and her friend Lucy Stone, were wearing these costumes out and about, and they were getting harassed and assaulted by men for wearing these costumes out and about. And they were like, a friend sent a carriage to pick them up so they could escape, because it was causing such a big ruckus. So yeah, she is, as with so many Americans in history... (laughs) she has had a huge impact... here in the United States. But she is also a problematic, complicated individual, because she was not supportive of black women being a part of the suffrage movement. And so it— she's a bit – as with so many – she's complicated.
Tom:
And the "I voted" stickers go on her grave if you're in Rochester, New York then. Thank you to Gary C for this next question. How did the website fatfingers.com help people to save money, and why is it no longer as useful today as it used to be? One more time. How did the website fatfingers.com help people to save money, and why is it no longer as useful today as it used to be?
Ruth:
Is it to do with... So, back in the age of the internet, when we were all choosing our lovely email addresses, some of which we do not use today...
Tom:
(chuckles)
Ruth:
If you accidentally type, then you could go back, and you could change it on fatfingers.com. But now you can't have a new email address 'cause they're all taken by us lots.
Tom:
You're right in that it was used in conjunction with another very famous site. Also, why did you go to that idea of the phrase 'fat fingers'?
Ruth:
Because I feel like fat fingers, mistype.
Tom:
Yes, absolutely.
Ruth:
As someone who's in the workshop and has long nails.
Evan:
Yeah.
Ruth:
I always get told like, "How can you do that?" And I'm like, it's fine. If I had fat fingers, I wouldn't be able to have very small hands. Fat fingers would be worst.
Evan:
When you're typing on your phone.
Ruth:
Yeah, or on your watch, if you've got a watch. Oh no.
Evan:
Oh yeah. It's so hard to, yeah. With your fat fingers.
Ruth:
So maybe you mistype to someone. I don't know. Oh, could you reverse a text or something? Could you...
Abby:
Oh.
Ruth:
Back in the day, when we didn't all have unlimited phone contracts, you could register online for... to get free texts. Was it something like that? There was really useful things that we would never use now on the internet back in the day.
Tom:
It is that kind of era, certainly. This will be pre-smartphone.
Abby:
I keep wondering if it's not to, if you accidentally find yourself on a seedy part of the internet, and you're trying to delete your browser history, or like you're... or you're trying to fix it, and it's like, fat fingers is like to delete all traces.
SFX:
(Abby and Tom laugh)
Tom:
You can do that in your browser though. A website wouldn't actually be allowed to do that. And remember, it's being used in conjunction with somewhere else.
Evan:
Yeah. I'm thinking about what the conjunction would be. If it's used with Google or a search engine, or if it's used with a very specific news website or...
Abby:
Yahoo.com. Ask Jeeves.
Evan:
♪ Yahoo! ♪
Tom:
It helped people to save money.
Ruth:
Oh yeah, that bit. Oh, was it in case you put your card details in wrong, or you didn't put in a... a coupon, a voucher on the site or something?
Tom:
No, and I love the idea that there is a website you type your credit card number into, to avoid...
Ruth:
It's mine.
Tom:
leaving your credit card details.
Ruth:
I've just started it. If you'd like to put your credit card details into it. I promise you it will stop you from having your details taken by anyone that isn't me.
Abby:
(giggles) It is definitely encrypted.
Ruth:
(guffaws)
Tom:
We're talking early e-commerce sites here.
Abby:
So it has to do with misspelling and fixing typing errors.
Tom:
Yep.
Abby:
It has to do with commerce.
Tom:
Yep.
Abby:
But it's not...
Ruth:
Is it, if you ordered 20 of something, like when people accidentally... they just couldn't understand, "Oh, I just want one of these." And instead, they put 11, and then they got a load of them? It was to undo that?
Tom:
There is another website which might help you with that, if you had a surplus of something, that was one of the old ones.
Evan:
eBay.
Tom:
eBay, spot on. This is in conjunction with— Well, not officially.
Abby:
Does it have to do with sniping? Did it work with sniping on eBay, where you would type in your amount, and Fat Fingers would...
Tom:
There was a different website to help with that, where you'd come in at the very last second with a bid, but not for this.
Abby:
You can tell that we did not do eBay as young people.
Evan:
Oh, I did eBay as a kid, actually.
Tom:
Yeah?
Evan:
I sold my Pokémon cards and my Beanie Babies. I didn't use any— See, I had very thin baby fingers, alright?
Abby:
That's—
Evan:
I had some Bobby fingers. I don't got no fat fingers.
Ruth:
Oh, was this a website where people who had misspelled items, it would show the listing, if someone was like, had misspelled "Beanie Baby", then no one was seeing their listing, which meant the bid was really low? So Fat Fingers found the people that couldn't spell?
Tom:
Absolutely right. FatFingers.com... Evan, you look confused here. Did— Do you wanna...?
Evan:
No, it makes sense. I'm just so surprised that that's so successful, because search was so bad that it would just be like, "Oh, you misspelled it. That's it."
Tom:
That's the last part of the puzzle, Evan. That's it. There wasn't really a good autocorrect system for eBay back then.
Evan:
Yeah.
Tom:
They didn't spell check everything that went in. These days, the site still exists. I think it still technically works. But you could type in, for example... So, so here's the thing. The example on my sheet says "AirPods", but those did not exist back then. But to this day—
Abby:
Like Beanie Babies.
Tom:
Yeah.
Evan:
Beanie Babies. That's what I would sell.
Tom:
Beanie Baby, it would give you a load of misspellings. It would search eBay for many different misspellings of "Beanie Babies" and give you back the ones that were misspelled. So you might be able to get it cheaper than normal. Evan, it is your question.
Evan:
This question has been sent from Dante Hicks. In the 1940s, visitors watching football games at Berkeley's Californian Memorial Stadium would often be plagued by beetles. What has caused this to stop in recent years? To repeat. In the 1940s, visitors watching football games at Berkeley's Californian Memorial Stadium would often be plagued by beetles. What has caused them to stop in recent years?
Ruth:
Global warming.
Abby:
Climate change.
Tom:
Massive—
SFX:
(Abby and Ruth laugh heartily)
Tom:
Yeah, okay, we're all...
Evan:
None.
Tom:
My answer was like, the massive depopulation of insect biomass because— You know what? Those were better answers, yeah.
Evan:
We've killed them all. No.
Abby:
They're dead. And California's on fire.
Tom:
Which is actually a problem. If you drive through a lot of... certainly America, certainly the UK... you no longer get huge amounts of bugs on your windscreen you have to wipe off. Because there has been a massive insect depopulation. I'm guessing that's not the sort of depressing answer that's in the question, Evan.
Ruth:
Bug spray. Bug sprays got really good. Killed a whole generation, wiped 'em out.
Abby:
Oh, yeah, deet just destroyed everything.
Evan:
No, I— This has nothin' to do with any of that at all actually.
Ruth:
Have they moved the stadium?
Abby:
No, they haven't. Because the bowl is iconic. My husband actually grew up in rural California, and he and his dad actually had season tickets to Cal to go and see the games. So I am really annoyed that he's not here right now to tap in and answer the question. But he's gonna be very excited when he listens to this episode, 'cause he'll probably know the answer. I don't know the answer. All I know is that it's old. The stadium is old, and...
Ruth:
Ooh, ooh. If the stadium's old, yeah, what do they sit on? Is the benches that they sit on are really old, and they're beetle infested, and now they replaced them
Evan:
No.
Ruth:
with plastic— Okay.
Evan:
It is the 1940s, by the way, so... That's not even a hint that I've been given to say. But I'm like, the 1940s, some things happened. I don't know.
Tom:
Oh, war.
Abby:
World War II.
Tom:
Yeah.
Abby:
Racism?
Evan:
(wheezes)
Abby:
Internment camps?
Evan:
Thank god we're past that.
Abby:
Yeah, thank god we're not living in that hellscape anymore! Jeez! Fascism, out the door! Not here anymore!
Evan:
In term— So lemme just reread it. So there were beetles that were plaguing the visitors of the football games.
Ruth:
It's too early for the Beatles band, right? So The Beatles, the band, yeah.
Tom:
And I don't think there's an opposing team called the Beetles that just—
Evan:
Correct.
Tom:
'Cause there are a lot of—
Evan:
No word play here.
Tom:
'Cause there are a lot of teams with stupid names.
Abby:
Yeah.
Tom:
You know, but there's— It's not like they were playing against the Beetles.
Abby:
I mean—
Tom:
Or playing the Beatles. It was just some beetles.
Evan:
Hm.
Abby:
Okay, so part of me is going into one of the issues that we've had in the United States, overall, when it comes to our native scape and ecology and whatnot, is this influx of invasive species. And like currently on the east coast, Evan, I'm sure you're aware, like the lantern fly is like a... Everyone's like, if you see it, kill it. Hold no mercy. Kill those things. We don't care if they're pretty. Murder them. Because they are destroying plants and trees and stuff. Ladybugs, we have real ladybugs here. And then we also have the Asian ladybug. And as someone who has to deal with that in Indiana, when they hatch out, they swarm everything. Like once— side tangent— I thought I was having a stroke or a seizure, because I thought I was smelling toast. And my husband was like, "Are you dying?" I was like, no. Turns out a ladybug had just flown into one of our lights in our ceiling that are these old really hot things, and it like – (poof) – on fire, and it just smelled like burning toast. Anyways. So I'm wondering, my point is this. I'm wondering if it has to do with an invasive species that we have finally eradicated. And it's a good thing that they're gone, because they never should have been there to begin with.
Evan:
Well... You smelt burnt toast.
SFX:
(guessers laugh in turn)
Evan:
I wonder if that... Which is quite, you know... 'Cause that bug, he was burning up in that lamp. That's quite an interesting story.
Ruth:
Did the bugs all dry out and die, 'cause it was too hot in the stadium?
Tom:
Or they're attracted to like food cart.
Abby:
The lights.
Tom:
Or something like that that we don—
Ruth:
The lights!
Tom:
The lights!
Evan:
You're on the right path right now. You were, mm. You're on the real right path though. Keep trying this.
Tom:
Are they using different lighting now? Because the bugs were—
Evan:
It's nothing to do with lighting.
Tom:
Oh! I was thinking the bugs were attracted to the lights or something like that.
Evan:
I did say they— the visitors, watching football games, were plagued by beetles.
Abby:
So if— Did they have little lanterns with them? Like little kerosene lanterns or little gas lanterns or...
Evan:
No, no, they— no. But I really like... I really like where you're going with that. As if in the 1940s, we're walking around with some ga— kerosene lanterns.
Abby:
I was like, this is weird. I dunno, why—
Evan:
"Can you see the Eagles?" "That's actually the Pittsburgh Steelers."
SFX:
(group laughing)
Evan:
I dunno why I did a British accent. But I do like the imagery that you're talking— I want you to explore the... What they're attracted to. What they're attracted to.
Abby:
Okay, so then we would've had thermoses, food. But like their— like coffee. Beer.
Evan:
No, they, yet again, not food at all. But I want you to go back to the lantern possibly, and think about something similar. I don't know.
Ruth:
What were they carrying? Were they carrying something that attracted them?
Evan:
The crowd were enjoying something, not necessarily food, that was attracting the beetles.
Abby:
So was it like noisemakers? Was it making a sound that would...
Evan:
No, not necessarily.
Tom:
Oh wait. Something like tobacco or... snuff or something like that, that the beetles happen to be attracted to?
Evan:
Yes, you're on the right page.
Abby:
Oh, okay, I'm like, where does the lantern have to do with cigarettes? But now I'm like, ah, lights.
Evan:
No, not lights!
Abby:
It's the flame! It's the flame burning! It's burning around my face, the flames! So cigarette, like smoke?
Evan:
Yes. But why?
Tom:
Are the beetles nesting or in the wooden structure or the seats or something like that, and they get smoked out by the amount of tobacco smoke that's there, or something like that?
Evan:
No, quite the opposite.
Ruth:
They like the smell of the— They like it.
Evan:
Yes, yes! Yes!
Tom:
Got there in the end.
Evan:
Yes. They're attracted to the smell. So these beetles are attracted to the smell of the smoke. Do— The name of these beetles— The insects are known as charcoal beetles.
Abby:
Oh!
Evan:
If you've ever heard of these. Charcoal beetles are also called fire chasing beetles, because they lay their eggs on freshly burnt trees. Easier for the larvae to eat. So at the stadium, thousands of spectators would light it up, light up some cigarettes at the same time, and that would make the beetles in the area think, "Oh, this is gonna be a forest fire." So they would swarm on in, and hit all the people smoking cigarettes. So they had to ban smoking in the stadium. Well, that was banned anyway, so... Either way, there you go. As smoking became less popular over the years, the beetle attacks reduced, and then they banned smoking. So now the beetles just look for real forest fires, which I guess isn't as hard to find these days, but there you go.
Tom:
The final part of the show, then. At the top, I asked this question sent in by Cameron Omara. Thank you, Cameron. A hotel has a Booking.com sticker in their window that is purposefully upside down. Why? Any quick guesses before I give that for the audience?
Ruth:
The only thing I can think of is, I'm a big fan of the theme park Efteling, and they have a ride called Villa Volta, and it goes— takes you upside down. And on the theme park map on the app, it is upside down because that's what the ride does. And I wonder if it's something like that. So like, this venue maybe goes down instead of up or something like that, which is why it's upside down?
Tom:
It's a lovely guess. And I appreciate it. And it's unfortunately completely wrong. I can't even yes-and that one. Sorry, Ruth.
Abby:
I thought it was something tongue-in-cheek with being southern hemisphere. With, you know, everyone's like, oh, their toilets go the opposite direction. It's like, so is someone just being in Australia or New Zealand, being just very cheeky about like, it's... you know, upside down type of thing, so...
Tom:
What do hotels usually put stickers for, in their windows?
Evan:
To promote how you can book. Where you can book. Services rendered.
Ruth:
Do they not want you to use Booking.com?
Tom:
No, they'd be happy with it. It'll help the business as long as you don't look too closely.
Abby:
Were the windows just dirty or something? And they were like, "Ooh, let's just cover that up."
Tom:
What might be on a sticker that Booking.com sends?
Abby:
A phone number, a website. Their actual thing. A QR code? (gasps) Was their QR code wrong? Did they have to flip it?
Tom:
Oh, no, no. QR codes will work the wrong way up. There is a very prominent number on that sticker.
Ruth:
Oh, is a rating? Is it a rating sticker?
Tom:
Yes.
Ruth:
Like they have a hygiene thing. And so instead of it looking like it was the worst hotel ever, it looked like the best?
Tom:
Yes. Why might they put that upside down?
Ruth:
Oh, '6' or '9'.
Tom:
There we go. Yes, close enough. The website rating for the hotel was 8.6. So they installed the sticker upside down, which looks like 9.8. Absolutely right. You got it there. What's going on in people's lives? Where can they find you? We will start today with Ruth.
Ruth:
So they can find me at Kids Invent Stuff, making kids' invention ideas. They can find me over on my channel, Ruth Amos, making bizarre things like 3D printing giant LEGO trees. and if you still watch normal TV or like to stream normal TV, you can catch me on Yesterday&U, bringing to life inventions from practical mechanics on Masters of Reinvention.
Tom:
Evan.
Evan:
You can find me at youtube.com/evan just making videos every Sunday on what I find interesting, and little differences between countries and such.
Tom:
And Abby.
Abby:
Mostly you can find me on YouTube, just Abby Cox, especially if you're into history, or fashion history, women's history. I'm also on every social thing. @IAmAbbyCox, and that, yeah.
Tom:
And if you wanna know more about this show, you can do that at lateralcast.com, where you can also send in your own ideas for questions. We are at @lateralcast basically everywhere, and there are regular video highlights at youtube.com/lateralcast. Thank you very much to Abby Cox.
Abby:
Thank you for having me! This is so fun! I'm so happy I got to come back. (laughs)
Tom:
Evan Edinger!
Evan:
That's me, hi.
Tom:
And Ruth Amos.
Ruth:
Thanks for having me.
Tom:
I've been Tom Scott, and that's been Lateral.
Episode Credits
| HOST | Tom Scott |
| QUESTION PRODUCER | David Bodycombe |
| EDITED BY | Julie Hassett at The Podcast Studios, Dublin |
| MUSIC | Karl-Ola Kjellholm ('Private Detective'/'Agrumes', courtesy of epidemicsound.com) |
| ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS | Nick, Madison M., Dante Hicks, Cameron Omara, David Lyford-Tilley, Gary C., Jackson Conte |
| FORMAT | Pad 26 Limited/Labyrinth Games Ltd |
| EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS | David Bodycombe and Tom Scott |