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Episode 96: The king of everywhere
Published 9th August, 2024
Ella Hubber, Caroline Roper and Tom Lum from 'Let's Learn Everything!' face questions about roundabout routes, mysterious messages and devillish doorbells.
HOST: Tom Scott. QUESTION PRODUCER: David Bodycombe. EDITED BY: Julie Hassett at The Podcast Studios, Dublin. MUSIC: Karl-Ola Kjellholm ('Private Detective'/'Agrumes', courtesy of epidemicsound.com). ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS: Xavier B., Cory Anderson, Alex Rinehart, Violet Moon, Lucas Neumeyer. FORMAT: Pad 26 Limited/Labyrinth Games Ltd. EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS: David Bodycombe and Tom Scott.
Transcript
Transcription by Caption+
Tom Scott:
Hannah takes off a wrapper and sees the message, "because then it would be a foot". Why?
The answer to that at the end of the show. My name's Tom Scott, and this is Lateral.
You fall down the well into a dingy room, lit by a single flaming torch. The only door is to the north. There is a soft grunting noise from the darkest corner.
Ella:
Examine the corner of the room with sword drawn.
Tom Scott:
You don't have a sword.
Ella:
(scoffs) Okay, make a sword first.
Tom Scott:
You take out your portable ford and make a sword.
SFX:
(metal clanking)
Tom Scott:
Three hours later, it has cooled into a wonderful scimitar.
Tom Lum:
I'll fire an arrow into the corner.
SFX:
(arrow impact)
Ella:
Why didn't you tell me you had a bow, Tom?
Tom Lum:
It's been in my knapsack the whole time.
Tom Scott:
You fire the arrow. A goblin falls over, clutching the arrow in its chest.
Caroline:
Ooh, ooh, open the chest with the silver key.
Tom Scott:
No, not a treasure chest. Like, his actual, his actual chest.
Caroline:
Oh, sorry, okay. I'm new to this, I've got it.
Tom Lum:
Can we examine the door?
Tom Scott:
The door is made from iron and seems sturdy. There appears to be a keyhole at the top, but it's too high to reach.
Caroline:
Oh, oh, stand on the chest!
Tom Scott:
But there's still no treasure chest. It's still, it's an actual, actual chest.
Caroline:
Right, okay, yes, sorry.
Ella:
Attach the key to an arrow and fire it from the bow towards the door.
Tom Scott:
I can roll for that if you want, but there's no way in a million years that's—
SFX:
(dice rolls)
Tom Scott:
(sighs heavily) The key snugly fits the lock, and you hear a faint click.
SFX:
(lock clicks)
(guests cheering)
Tom Lum:
Woo-woo-woo! Push on the door!
Tom Scott:
You push on the door, and it swings slowly open.
You see a man sitting by a table, holding a parchment, summoning up the energy to speak, and he mutters the words...
Welcome to the show! We have all the team from Let's Learn Everything! Welcome back, everyone! How are you doing?
Tom Lum:
Wait, wait, have you been recording this whole time? I thought we were just playing a game of D&D. Oh, man!
SFX:
(Caroline and Ella laugh)
Tom Lum:
This is how you always get us on! You trick us!
SFX:
(both Toms laugh)
Tom Scott:
It is lovely to see you all again.
The last time we talked, I was on your podcast. So, Caroline, do you want to introduce who you are, where you're all from?
Caroline:
Absolutely, yes.
So, we are Let's Learn Everything: Caroline, Ella, and Tom. We are a podcast that talks about literally anything and everything that we find interesting.
Tom Scott:
Ella, what did I come on to talk about a little while ago?
Ella:
You came on to talk about human acceleration. The fastest you can accelerate a human, a normal human can accelerate from 0–60 miles per hour.
There were a lot of twists and turns in the episode that I don't think even you were expecting.
Caroline:
Yeah.
Tom Scott:
(snickers) Yeah.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom Lum:
Yeah.
Tom Scott:
And Tom... why can't you say what's coming up?
Tom Lum:
Because we don't know, and we don't want to spoil it for each other.
That's part of the joy of it, is each of us brings in a topic to share to the rest of us, and yeah.
Tom Scott:
Well, adventurers from Let's Learn Everything, it's time to progress onto the next dungeon. Have your weapons of quick wit and guile to hand as we venture forth to question one.
Tom Lum:
I'm so glad we can use our weapons for these. That's so nice. That's so much easier.
Caroline:
(giggles)
Tom Scott:
Our first question has been sent in by Violet Moon. Thank you, Violet.
In a 1961 TV advert, the cartoon character Fred Flintstone says, "Winston tastes good, like a cigarette should." The successful campaign made Winston the No. 2 cigarette brand in the US. Why was the American public appalled?
I'll give you that one more time.
In a 1961 TV advert, the cartoon character Fred Flintstone says, "Winston tastes good, like a cigarette should." The successful campaign made Winston the No. 2 cigarette brand in the US. Why was the American public appalled?
Tom Lum:
You mean besides the normal reasons?
SFX:
(group laughing)
Ella:
Yeah. I have an idea which I think is so absurd that I think it could be right. So...
Tom Scott:
Alright.
SFX:
(Tom Lum and Ella laugh)
Caroline:
Perfect. Wow.
Ella:
What year did you say it was?
Tom Scott:
1961.
Ella:
Okay, so it's after World War II, but still within the memory of people.
So I'm— My guess is that the number— the previous number one cigarette brand was called Uncle Sam or something, and everyone's really annoyed that it's called Winston after Winston Churchill now.
Tom Lum:
Ohhh!
Tom Scott:
Oh!
Tom Lum:
That specifically! Even though, even though we were on, I think on the same side of World War II. They're still like, "Yeah, but."
SFX:
(Caroline and Tom Scott laugh)
Tom Lum:
This is position number two, right, you said? That this moved up to, not even first place?
Tom Scott:
Yeah, it was fifth. It went up to second place.
Tom Lum:
I don't know if that would be part of it.
Ella:
It bumped down...
Caroline:
Some real popular...
Tom Lum:
America's Best.
Caroline:
Yeah. (laughs)
Ella:
Yeah. So okay, not that then. But I thought that was really good lateral thinking, and I'd just like everyone to acknowledge that.
Tom Lum:
Oh no, yeah, that was great.
Tom Scott:
That was lovely.
Caroline:
That was wonderful.
Tom Lum:
The Winston connection.
Could it be the reverse of our modern sensibilities? Could it be that maybe he, Fred, was making fun of the cigarettes rather than actually endorsing them? And so that was...
Caroline:
Interesting.
Ella:
It was like a reverse boycott.
Tom Lum:
Yeah. And so they were like, "No, we love Winston's." And actually, in the clip, he's being sarcastic or something like that.
Caroline:
Oh, and people going out and buying it as an act of rebellion against the Flintstones, basically?
Tom Lum:
Yeah, I don't know. I love hearing about these... old versions of cartoons getting canceled or causing a stir. It's like, "Ah, we've always been insufferable with our media."
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom Scott:
The Flintstones was originally a cartoon designed for adults.
The original show had a laugh track. It was an animated sitcom.
I mean, family is probably a better term than adults, but it was deliberately not a kids cartoon. It was framed as just a regular sitcom that happened to be animated.
Tom Lum:
Huh, I didn't know that.
Caroline:
Oh, I didn't know that, huh.
Ella:
Was that a clue?
Tom Scott:
Well, I feel like we should get the obvious out of the way here.
Someone fall on the sword here and suggest why the American public might have been appalled at a cartoon character selling cigarettes.
Caroline:
Because it's a cartoon character selling cigarettes to children. That's not a good thing, yeah.
Tom Scott:
Yeah, nothing to do with that. Cartoons selling cigarettes, absolutely fine in the '60s, particularly given that it was pointed at adults.
If another brand had run the same campaign, it would have had the same effect.
Tom Lum:
Got it, yeah, okay. Good to clear the air, just to be crystal clear on that.
Caroline:
Yeah, yeah.
Tom Scott:
Well, "clear" the air.
Caroline:
(laughs heartily)
Tom Lum:
Heyo!
Caroline:
My other thought was, is Winston the name of another character? There's—
Isn't there a dinosaur that's meant to be the family dog? And it's implied that they killed the family dog and then did something to—
Ella:
And smoked him?!
Caroline:
Well, yeah, you know.
Tom Scott:
What?
Tom Lum:
(laughs uproariously)
Caroline:
Winston, I need it to go to, that's a dog's name. So maybe they killed their dog, and now have led to this advert.
I don't know, that's just where my brain went.
Tom Lum:
I think their dinosaur is named Dino, and that's their pet, I believe.
Caroline:
Oh, was it? Okay.
Tom Lum:
For all the Flint-heads out there.
SFX:
(Tom Scott and Caroline laugh)
Tom Scott:
Is that the genuine name for Flintstones fans? I don't know, but I believe it.
Caroline:
Yeah. (laughs)
Tom Scott:
Yeah.
Tom Lum:
What would they be upset about?
Caroline:
Yeah, is it to do with the cigarette brand that was bumped down to third place? Is there some weird...
Tom Scott:
No.
Caroline:
Okay.
Tom Lum:
Could the— Could maybe what they drew for the cigarette versus the actual name of it be different? Like, could it look like a Marlboro logo when actually it was supposed to be advertising Winston?
It's also interesting because it's the public that's outraged, not the company. So I'm curious.
Caroline:
It's weird that it's both public outrage, but also its sales got bumped up. Both of those things happened.
Tom Lum:
Yeah, right? How can it be both?
Caroline:
Yeah.
Ella:
That implies to me that there was something... negative about the cigarettes in the cartoon that meant people were like, "I'm gonna go and buy this now to kind of screw you."
Tom Lum:
Yeah did he hack— cough a ton in the— as a joke when he was using the cigarette or something like that?
Tom Scott:
It was a regular ad read, that "Winston tastes good, like a cigarette should."
Caroline:
Was it not a cigarette? Is a Winston a cigarette brand, definitely?
Tom Scott:
It is...?
Caroline:
Are they trying to sell— like false advertising almost?
Tom Scott:
Not that, but...
Ella:
They don't taste good.
Caroline:
(laughs uproariously)
Ella:
So everyone just bought them, and they were like, these are horrible.
Tom Lum:
(laughs)
Ella:
Like cigarettes are.
Tom Scott:
This is the sort of complaint that you would still get today. The wording would be different, but...
What sort of thing do some people like to complain about? For things they see or hear on TV?
Tom Lum:
False advertising? Maybe like when cereal boxes say "enlarged to show scale", was it cartoonishly big or something like that? And they were like, "Aw man."
Or it's like when cartoon food looks so good. You know, like when a steak on Tom and Jerry looks so good, or any other—
Tom Scott:
Oh yeah, this cigarette did not make me lift off my feet and waft through the air towards it.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom Lum:
You went, "Awooga!"
SFX:
(group laughing)
Caroline:
If it had been a different cigarette brand, would there have been the same outrage?
Tom Scott:
If the slogan was the same, yes.
Caroline:
Ohhh.
Ella:
Oh.
Caroline:
Interesting.
Tom Lum:
Oh, "tastes good, like a cigarette should", right, is the slogan?
Was the implication that you were eating them? You had to eat the cigarette?
Tom Scott:
(chuckles)
Tom Lum:
(wheezes)
Ella:
I'm stumped.
Tom Lum:
We're all such good samaritans who would never smoke a cigarette. So it's tricky for us, Tom.
Ella:
No, of course.
Caroline:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
Hmm.
Tom Scott:
The same complaints... and I don't know where this is going to land... as a clue, but...
The same complaints were heard about the narration of Star Trek, that opening sequence, that same sort of complaint.
Ella:
What's the opening of Star Trek? Does anyone know? The originals?
Tom Scott:
To boldly go where no one has gone before.
Ella:
Oh, it's grammatically incorrect?
SFX:
(Tom Lum and Caroline gasp)
Tom Scott:
Yes. It's grammatically incorrect.
Tom Lum:
No!
Caroline:
No way! Well done, Ella!
Tom Lum:
Ella!
Caroline:
Oh my goodness! Oh, wow!
Tom Scott:
Yeah.
Tom Lum:
And, truly, what's killing more Americans? It's really grammar, not cigarettes, that's killing Americans.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom Lum:
That's really the issue we should be focusing on. (laughs heartily)
Tom Scott:
At that point, the world had not fully switched over to using 'like' instead of 'as' in a comparison.
Ella:
Ohh!
Tom Lum:
So it's even of the time!
Tom Scott:
The quote-unquote "correct" way of doing it would be "Winston tastes good, as a cigarette should." I hate that I keep repeating this advertising slogan. Please don't smoke, please.
SFX:
(guests laugh uproariously)
Tom Scott:
Also, don't smoke kids.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom Scott:
It should have been 'as' rather than 'like'.
I'm a linguist, 'should' is in scare quotes there. But the sort of people who get angry about pedantic things like that, like the opening narration of Star Trek, wrote in to complain.
That was the fracar about that slogan. Not that cartoon characters were selling cigarettes. Not even the idea that there was cigarette advertising... but their words should have been slightly different.
Caroline, over to you for the next question.
Caroline:
This question has been sent in by Cory Anderson.
In 2016, the new King of Poland was declared in an official ceremony attended by the country's President. This King reigns over more people outside of Poland than within. How?
I'll say that one again.
In 2016, the new King of Poland was declared in an official ceremony that was attended by the country's President. This King reigns over more people outside of Poland than within. How?
Ella:
I didn't even know that Poland had a monarchy, for a start. I don't think Poland has a monarchy.
SFX:
(both Toms laugh)
Tom Lum:
What was the year again, Caroline?
Caroline:
2016.
Tom Lum:
Okay.
Ella:
Is it because Poland doesn't have a monarchy, so it technically does not reign over anyone inside of Poland? So it's like...
Caroline:
(laughs)
Ella:
(chuckles)
Tom Lum:
My...
Tom Scott:
I feel like it's the Polish Republic. I might be wrong there.
Caroline:
Well, yeah, and the country's president was there as well.
Tom Lum:
Was there.
Caroline:
I'd like to highlight that fact.
Ella:
Oh, that's a good— That's a very good point.
Caroline:
Yeah, yeah.
SFX:
(Tom Scott and Caroline laugh)
Tom Lum:
My... my thought was this was one of those... some sort of trick. It's like the two books that's like what you learn in Harvard Business School and what they don't teach you in Harvard Business School.
SFX:
(Tom Scott and Caroline laugh)
Tom Lum:
And where it's like, you have the king of the Poland and the king of not-Poland. And so it's like, they subsume the rest.
Ella:
They— is it like Poland is a republic, the actual, you know, country of Poland, but Poland has overseas territories that are still not republics? They're still reign— having the Polish monarchy.
Tom Scott:
I mean, that was true for the British Empire for a long time.
There were more people who were British subjects, who were subjects of the monarch, outside the United Kingdom than there were inside. Just because... we'd taken a lot of stuff, you know?
Caroline:
Mhm, yeah.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Ella:
Eeegh.
Tom Lum:
I don't think the Polish Museum is as extensive as the British Museum, so I don't know if that—
Tom Scott:
No, Poland never really had a colonial era that I know of.
SFX:
(Caroline and Tom Lum laugh)
Ella:
Yeah, I didn't think so.
Caroline:
No, strictly speaking, this kingship is more symbolic than legal.
Tom Lum:
Okay, is it the king of... the brand Poland Springs? Is there some wording here that...
SFX:
(others laughing)
Tom Scott:
I mean if it was Iceland, then I could absolutely believe that the supermarket chain Iceland had just decided to elect a king as a publicity stunt.
Tom Lum:
(laughs)
Caroline:
(laughs) Yeah.
Ella:
Oh, that would be...
Tom Lum:
Could it be something that... something in, you know, the old wording of the... the kingship of Poland is something that whoever— wherever a Polish citizen is on the world, technically that counts as the kingdom of Poland, right?
Like the symbolic kingdom of Poland is wherever a Pole is in the world or something like that.
Caroline:
Well, and that then in turn takes over every single person in that area so that there could be more people reigned outside of Poland than within. Okay, yeah, that's fun. I like that.
Tom Lum:
Yeah, if it's symbolic at this point, you can just be like...
Caroline:
Yeah.
Tom Lum:
"Technically this is within the kingdom of Poland."
Tom Scott:
Are you within five metres of someone from Poland? You are now a subject of the king. That's how it works.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom Lum:
The wording, the wording was... that it's a territory larger than the actual country? Or what was the wording of that again?
Tom Scott:
Rules over more people outside Poland, right?
Caroline:
This king reigns over more people outside of Poland than within.
Tom Scott:
Why did you pedant me on 'reign' over 'rule'? There's something there.
Tom Lum:
Yeah, it's a cloud!
Caroline:
(laughs)
Ella:
Is it spelled R-A-I-N-S, and he owns some kind of cloud busting machine?
SFX:
(Caroline and Tom Lum laugh)
Caroline:
No, it is the spelling R-E-I-G-N-S, reigns.
Ella:
People, not horses. I'm thinking now reigns, like horse reigns.
Caroline:
Oh, I love it! (laughs heartily)
Tom Lum:
And so, are we right? Is this at all related to an older lineage of kings, or is this a brand new thing that came up in 2016?
Caroline:
I will say that his reign is... more than just a royal connection.
Tom Scott:
Have we established this is the country of Poland?
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom Scott:
Because I feel like this might be like Poland, New Jersey, or... Poland, Queensland, Australia, or...
Caroline:
No, this is 100% the country of Poland.
Tom Scott:
Oh yeah, 'cause you said there was a president as well, alright.
Caroline:
Yes.
Ella:
You can— Yeah, there's a president of Poland, New Jersey, Tom.
Tom Lum:
New Jersey, yeah.
Caroline:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
Geoff, I know him. We're good friends. He's always at the diner.
Ella:
So, you're saying 'reign' in a different sense of the word 'reign'.
Tom Lum:
Does it mean just being above? Like physically above? So you're surveying more people because you're high up?
Caroline:
It's more than that. It is still in the sense of reigning over, but... not necessarily... royalty as such.
Think of other people who have been said to reign over someone.
Ella:
God? (wheezes)
Caroline:
Ella... Ella...
Ella:
Wait, sorry, it's God? Oh my— God is the King of Poland?!
Caroline:
You are so, so close. It's not God.
Ella:
Jesus!
Tom Lum:
Huh?
Caroline:
Yes! (laughs)
Ella:
Jesus is the King of Poland!
Caroline:
(laughs uproariously)
Ella:
(wheezes)
Caroline:
I'll let that sink in for a second.
Tom Scott:
Yeah, because Polish politics was becoming much more conservative and much more religious in 2016.
I was in Poland just after the last election, just as it started to swing back.
Caroline:
Oh, gosh, yeah.
Tom Scott:
I remember some of the folks I was talking to saying, "Yeah, no, things are changing again."
Caroline:
Mhm, mhm.
Tom Scott:
Yeah... They officially proclaimed Jesus as King of Poland as a— basically a political stunt, right?
Tom Lum:
You know what, and honestly, 2016 might have been a hint if we had been thinking about just that period of time. Yeah.
Caroline:
Yeah. (laughs) Yeah, that's right.
So, Jesus Christ has officially been declared the King of Poland. This was part of the "Jubilee Act of Accepting Christ as Our King and Lord", and it was approved in April of 2016. It was read at a special ceremony on the 19th of November that year with President Andrzej Duda in attendance alongside members of the Polish clergy and thousands of pilgrims.
For anybody who's still stuck on that 'reigning' thing that we were talking about earlier:
As the King of Kings, Jesus reigns over His believers. And naturally there are more Christians outside of Poland than within.
Tom Lum:
Okay.
Ella:
I see.
Tom Scott:
That's a good question. I like that.
Caroline:
Tom, to your point earlier, talking about how Christian the country is:
In the 2021 census, 71% of Polish people, of the Polish population, identified as Roman Catholic. So... quite a large percentage of the population.
Tom Lum:
Oh, wow.
Caroline:
Yeah, yeah. At 167 feet, Poland has the tallest statue of Jesus.
Tom Lum:
Oh!
Caroline:
I'm going to try and pronounce the name of the place. It's at Świebodzin... and it had an internet antenna inside its crown until they were removed in 2018, which is just...
Tom Lum:
(wheezes)
Caroline:
Fun little fact for you.
Ella:
Okay.
Tom Scott:
Alright, good luck with this one, folks.
In 2018, the Nikola company posted a video of their new electric truck on a long desert highway. The accompanying announcement said, "Behold the 1,000 horsepower, zero-emission Nikola One semi-truck in motion". What was the catch?
I'll say that again.
In 2018, the Nikola company posted a video of their new electric truck on a long desert highway. The accompanying announcement said, "Behold the 1,000 horsepower, zero emission Nikola One semi-truck in motion". What was the catch?
Tom Lum:
2018. My first thing is... I feel like by calling it the Nikola company, it is a pastiche of Tesla.
Ella:
Tesla.
Caroline:
Yeah!
Ella:
Yeah.
Tom Lum:
So... I don't... and I don't know if I've heard of this company. So part of me wonders if this is some kind of publicity stunt to poke fun at them.
Ella:
It's, sorry... 1,000 horsepower, zero emissions... electric truck. These are the details. It can't move. (wheezes)
Caroline:
Yeah, my initial thought went to, it was being pulled by something else, like a horse?
Tom Lum:
1,000 horses, yeah, that was my thought too.
Caroline:
Yes!
Tom Scott:
(laughs)
Ella:
As I've learned recently, horses are normally more than one horsepower. So it was probably less than 1,000 horses.
Caroline:
Yes, that's true. (laughs)
Tom Lum:
And also, because they produce methane, they wouldn't be zero-emission.
Caroline:
It wouldn't be zero-emission. That's such a good point.
Tom Scott:
Oh, that's true.
Ella:
Pulled by 1,000 kangaroos. They don't produce much methane. (cracks up)
Caroline:
(laughs)
Ella:
That's the answer, right?
Tom Lum:
We're coming— We're solving this climate crisis together. Smarter. Think smarter. Not harder.
Caroline:
Was it like— You know how trams have to be attached on a rail and above their head with a cable?
Tom Lum:
Caroline.
Caroline:
To move? Is that what it was?
Tom Lum:
Is it, yeah, was this a train?
Tom Scott:
I have actually filmed a setup like that in the past.
Caroline:
(gasps)
Tom Scott:
There's a couple of e-highways being tested in the world.
Caroline:
Ooh.
Tom Lum:
Oh, cool.
Tom Scott:
I don't know if it's going to happen. I kinda hope it does, because I think it's a good solution.
Tom Lum:
Yeah.
Caroline:
Uh-huh.
Tom Scott:
In that case, they have to build out the same gantries that you'd see on an electric train.
Caroline:
Right, yeah.
Tom Scott:
And then you have a truck with a small battery that can just link up for the highway sections. Not here, this was a long desert highway.
Tom Lum:
Right, right.
Caroline:
Huh.
Tom Lum:
And is that a clue or not?
Ella:
Was it very— It was very small. It was the only way to get it to power it that much. It's very, very tiny. It's a toy car.
Caroline:
Was it a toy or a cardboard car or something? Was it not actually a car or truck?
Tom Scott:
It was absolutely true, really.
Tom Lum:
(snorts)
Caroline:
Okay. Really?
Tom Scott:
It was a 1,000 horsepower, zero-emission semi-truck, and it was in motion.
Tom Lum:
Could it have been downhill in the desert?
Tom Scott:
Yes, absolutely.
Caroline:
(gasps)
Ella:
So they just release—
Caroline:
No way.
Ella:
They just let it go.
SFX:
(Caroline and Ella laugh)
Tom Scott:
Yes.
Tom Lum:
Oh—! (blurts laugh) The simplicity of you saying it that way, Ella, was really...
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom Lum:
So they just let it go.
Ella:
I was going to suggest a slingshot. So I guess this is a better solution.
Caroline:
Yeah. (laughs)
SFX:
(Tom Scott and Ella laugh)
Caroline:
I love that we went to slingshot before gravity.
Ella:
I know!
Tom Scott:
Mhm, yeah.
Caroline:
Every time.
SFX:
(Tom Lum and Caroline laugh)
Tom Lum:
Did they just have it just on top of a dune or a hill, and just had it roll down, and they were like, "Look at this thing"?
Caroline:
And did they then record it and then tilt it so that it looked like it was going flat? (laughs)
Tom Scott:
Well... The reason it was a long desert highway is that you can kinda get away with hiding a very slight gradient there.
Caroline:
Wow. Okay.
Tom Lum:
Oh.
Caroline:
That's mad.
Tom Scott:
The Nikola One was supposed to use a hydrogen fuel cell. You're absolutely right. They were playing off the Tesla name as well.
At the time of that, they did not have a 100% working prototype. The batteries and the gearbox worked... but in 2020 they admitted that the video they put out was just a truck that was rolling down a very long, shallow hill.
SFX:
(Caroline and Ella cackle)
Tom Lum:
(claps)
Ella:
Hydrogen fuel cells are in use, though, right now. I'm sure I saw a bus that said it was used, in Cardiff, that said it was using them.
Tom Lum:
Now, but was it rolling downhill, Ella?
Ella:
That's true, it's very hilly.
Tom Lum:
Whenever they roll downhill, they flip the sign, and it's like, "In use!"
Tom Scott:
There are a few places that use hydrogen fuel cells.
There's the Orkney Islands in the UK, can use them for some things. But that's because they've got a surplus of electricity. So when they have too much wind power and nowhere to send it, they will just generate hydrogen and then use that to power fuel cells.
So it can kind of work as a battery. It's not very efficient right now.
In 2023, Nikola founder Trevor Milton was sentenced to four years in jail for three counts of fraud while CEO of the company.
Caroline:
Oh my goodness!
Tom Scott:
So if you're wondering why we're being slightly less careful than usual with our libel and slander concerns here, it's because the CEO was jailed for fraud.
Tom Lum:
Ah.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Ella:
Yeah. Fair enough, fair enough.
Caroline:
Fair enough, yeah.
Tom Lum:
I thought you were going to say three counts of fraud while downhill. While rolling downhill.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom Scott:
Oh, that does make it worse, yeah. Committing fraud while going downhill absolutely just increases the sentence.
Caroline:
It adds a year, yeah.
SFX:
(Tom Lum and Ella laugh)
Tom Scott:
Yeah.
Tom Lum:
It's all downhill from here.
SFX:
(others groan)
Caroline:
Wow.
Tom Lum:
(wheezes)
Tom Scott:
Tom, your question. Over to you.
Tom Lum:
This question has been sent in by Alex Rinehart.
In 2022, during an American video game tournament, Omega greeted Sonix, saying: "I'm a huge fan. To stain the battlefield with your blood will be a huge honour." Sonix requested a lag test, and Omega was duly disqualified. Why?
I'll say that again.
In 2022, during an American video game tournament, Omega greeted Sonix – Sonix with an X, not really relevant, just wanted to clarify – saying: "I'm a huge fan. To stain the battlefield with your blood will be a huge honour." Sonix requested a lag test, and Omega was duly disqualified. Why?
Caroline:
For a second, I did think you meant Sonic, multiple Sonic the Hedgehog cosplayers that you were talking about.
Tom Scott:
Yeah, I was thinking that.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom Lum:
A team of Sonics.
Caroline:
The battlefield with their blood? That's really intense, Omega, wow. (giggles)
Tom Lum:
(wheezes)
Tom Scott:
Omega, of course, being the godlike villain from Doctor Who. So it's just completely unmatched battlefield here.
Tom Lum:
Yeah.
Ella:
They're talking to each other. Is this on screen? So, one of the people can see that something is wrong with the way that they're communicating with each other?
Tom Lum:
So, I believe they were— This interaction was happening via a text chat.
Caroline:
Right.
Ella:
Within the game?
Tom Lum:
Outside the game, in an outside chat system. But they were playing the game, you know, together.
Ella:
Is it... Smash Bros.?
Tom Lum:
It is actually, yeah.
Ella:
I just— That's the only game I know that has very regular tournaments.
Tom Lum:
Mhm. Don't know how that'll help you.
Caroline:
I was gonna say, is that relevant?
Tom Lum:
"Ah, it's Jigglypuff, I knew it!"
Ella:
Well, I've exhausted my game knowledge.
Tom Scott:
I mean, we've exhausted mine. The last time I had to deal with video game lag, I think I was like 14, 15. We just switched from dial-up to a cable modem, and suddenly the ping was less than 250 milliseconds.
This is how ancient my game knowledge is, unfortunately.
Tom Lum:
Yeah, I don't— We're not dealing on that scale of lag here.
Tom Scott:
You said Smash Bros. So, that is a game where... frame-accurate inputs are important. Like the twitch of a button, if it's a fraction of a second earlier or later, will make a difference.
And playing online can be difficult because of that, because... the code has to deal with everything that might be lagging a little, and the lag will change over time.
Caroline:
Right.
Tom Scott:
So, what if the lag was too low? What if the disqualified player was not actually playing over an internet connection?
Or, they had an advantage because they were actually playing on the console that was hooked in there, instead of they should have been over an internet connection.
Tom Lum:
I'll say that's a great hunch. But surprisingly, that is actually not the factor. It's actually not the delay affecting the abilities of the players. It's something else.
Ella:
Is it the text? Is it the texting between them? Like there was... It just took too long to reply between those messages that they had exchanged or... and so, you know, there was... some kind of delay between them.
Tom Scott:
Or it's too quick, again. That response was lightning fast. It must have been pasted from somewhere. They must have been using something to cheat, because they were just able to paste that response in.
But I don't think pasting is cheating really.
Caroline:
Yeah, or even maybe using an AI to get those texts in faster. Like it wasn't actually a person.
Tom Scott:
What year was that?
Tom Lum:
2022, so that...
Caroline:
Oh, okay.
Tom Scott:
Okay.
Tom Lum:
I'll say... You're right that it is something about the message.
But you are incorrect that it is something to do with sort of... a lag test in the traditional way that you guys are thinking, where they have some unfair advantage by being too fast or too slow.
Although maybe... the lag test did come back... being laggier or taking longer than you would think. So if anything, maybe Omega would have a disadvantage.
But that's not what's going on here. That's not the reason for the disqualification.
Caroline:
Did calling a lag test activate something that then looked at the chat logs... and there was a keyword in there, like, what was the specific phrasing of that message? Mentioning blood then automatically meant that you got disqualified or something?
Tom Lum:
Caroline you are getting very, very close. It is—
Caroline:
Ooh, okay.
Tom Lum:
I'll read the message one more time.
And I'll also say this clue, which is that this podcast is... Our podcast is very specifically equipped for this kind of a detail and this kind of problem. I was so excited when we got this question.
So I'll read it again.
"I'm a huge fan. To stain the battlefield with your blood will be a huge honour."
Tom Scott:
Did he spell 'honour' the British way?
Tom Lum:
He sure did.
Caroline:
Ooh!
Tom Scott:
Did he put a U in there?
Tom Lum:
He sure did.
Caroline:
No!
Tom Scott:
And then the lag test is... He's—
Maybe he's just in the wrong region and thus disqualified.
Or maybe it's actually someone playing for him who's in a different location, and he's put a ringer in.
Tom Lum:
It's simpler as that.
It truly was a person from the UK playing in an American tournament trying to get away with it.
Caroline:
No way!
SFX:
(Tom Scott and Caroline laugh)
Tom Lum:
It's amazing. It was also—
So, the player is more commonly known as Darkstalker, and he was using an alias, I believe, for this tournament. So there was some of that.
Caroline:
Oh, okay.
Tom Lum:
And there is— There exists a clip of the chat log that was very funny, that I can only get a few words from, but you can see one of the moderators say:
"hold the f-ing phone... my man... my brother in christ... where do you HAIL from?" And the guy goes—
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom Lum:
The guy goes, "London rn".
And it's really— You can— It's in the chat log.
You can see Sonix say, he says, "I've seen you play peli too much to know what you play like bruh."
And then Omega goes, "Damn you!"
Caroline:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
And then Sonix goes, "If you hadn't said what you said in the beginning, I wouldn't have thought much of it."
It's a real Columbo moment. It's amazing.
Caroline:
Wow!
Ella:
Wow!
Tom Scott:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
So yeah, they used the British spelling of 'honour' with a U, which tipped off Sonix, who called for a lag test. And then the moderators confirmed that they were not in America.
Tom Scott:
The next question was sent in by Lucas Neumeyer. Thank you very much, Lucas.
During the American Civil War, Confederate General John Magruder ordered his soldiers to march in a long, elliptical route for a while. Or route, I guess. Why?
I'll say that again.
During the American Civil War, Confederate General John Magruder ordered his soldiers to march in a long elliptical route for a while. Why?
Ella:
An elliptical is like a crescent shape?
Tom Lum:
An oval, right?
Ella:
Oh, an oval, an oval.
Caroline:
Like an oval? Okay.
Tom Scott:
Yep.
Tom Lum:
My brain first went to some— They were like, that's the best route to... watch the eclipse or watch some astronomical phenomena.
Caroline:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
Is in an ellipse.
Caroline:
Ooh.
Tom Lum:
Is this the era of warfare where people just stand in a line and shoot across a field at each other? And so is this sort of like... the.... earliest strategy of warfare, is like, "Now walk in an ellipse, and they'll be illusioned by us!"
SFX:
(Caroline and Ella laugh)
Tom Scott:
Sorry, what was that last bit, Tom?
Tom Lum:
I said illusioned. Is this... Is this actually some sort of zebra phenomenon where if you move in a...
Ella:
Oho!
Caroline:
Oh, you see, my brain goes to like, is it kicking up dust or something to create a...
Tom Lum:
Ooh. That's awesome, yeah.
Caroline:
a shield to hide? My initial brain went to, this is a punishment for them doing something wrong. Because I'm glad it's not that, you know?
Tom Lum:
Now everyone, 50 ellipses, let's go!
Caroline:
Yeah! (laughs)
Tom Lum:
Hey, watch the foci! That's not an ellipse!
SFX:
(group laughing)
Ella:
Yeah, is it like the... They're walking back and forth in an ellipse, right, but in two lines. And one lot is wearing white, and one's wearing black. So like Tom's saying, it's giving some kind of—
Caroline:
They blend in!
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Ella:
So you're like, whoa!
Tom Scott:
Dazzle camouflage in the Civil War!
SFX:
(laughter intensifies)
Ella:
Oh, it's like one of those magic pictures. It's like one of those magic pictures. Like when you pull it away from your eyes, and something appears, and it just says... "Go away, leave us alone."
Tom Lum:
"Abe Lincoln can suck it" or something.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Caroline:
"Let us win." Is it like when animals try to make themselves look bigger to seem more scary? Are all of these people going backwards and forwards to try and look like a big army or something?
Ella:
Yeah.
Caroline:
(gasps)
Tom Scott:
Yeah.
Caroline:
I said that as a joke! I said that as a joke!
Tom Lum:
This is— This could be stupid. Is it because... Because an ellipse is like a squashed circle, right? And so is the idea that it creates the illusion that they have a full circle of a much bigger one that's actually a squished ellipse? Maybe that's overthinking it, but—
Tom Scott:
It's much simpler than that.
You're right, they were trying to make the army look bigger.
I'm gonna ask you to connect how that might work. There's something about the battlefield and the region around it that made this possible.
Tom Lum:
Oh?
Caroline:
Oh, maybe there was lots of tree cover. So they could only see one section. So it looked like loads of people going through.
Oh my goodness, I'm on a roll right now!
Tom Lum:
Commander General Caroline!
Ella:
Well done. (applauds)
Tom Scott:
Yep. Part of the oval route was obscured by trees. So knowing that the opposing general had a habit of overestimating the enemy's manpower and didn't really like attacking if they weren't sure... Confederate General John Magruder just said, "Just march past the trees a lot. In an oval route.
Caroline:
(laughs)
Tom Scott:
"And they will think there are far more than there are." And... it did work. You were also right about noise. Magruder's men were ordered to make as much noise as possible. Shouting fake orders, kicking up dust, just to create as much of an illusion of people as possible.
Tom Lum:
"Oh man! How are we gonna feed our 100,000 soldiers over in the tree?" They also had a guy in the back of the trees handing them mustaches. So they would look like different people when they came around.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Caroline:
"You get a pair of glasses this time. You get the fake nose." Yeah.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom Scott:
Ella, over to you for the next question.
Ella:
This question has been sent in by Xavier B.
In a 2022 game against the Texas Rangers, the public address system of the Tampa Bay Rays started to play doorbell noises, as it was a theme night. Why?
I'll say that again.
In a 2022 game against the Texas Rangers, the public address system of the Tampa Bay Rays started to play doorbell noises, as it was a theme night. Why?
Not why was it a theme night? (wheezes)
SFX:
(Tom and Caroline laugh)
Tom Lum:
...Oh!
Caroline:
Was the theme the Book of Mormon musical, and they were playing the beginning song where they press the bells over and over again?
Tom Scott:
In a reference that will be lost for multiple reasons on all the people in this call...
It was a Noel's House Party theme night, and they just had a man in a big wig and a beard repeatedly opening the door to celebrities.
Ella:
I've seen Noel's House Party, Tom Scott. I'm not that—
Tom Scott:
I'm so sorry.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom Lum:
Yeah, she's seen Noel's House Party.
Caroline:
Yeah! And that collectively means all of us have, yes.
Tom Scott:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
Was the theme 'doors'?
Ella:
Knowing the theme will help you.
Tom Scott:
(laughs) Yeah, damn right it will!
Tom Lum:
(laughs uproariously)
Caroline:
I'm so glad. (laughs)
Ella:
Just wanna throw out— I thought I'd just throw out some really useless clues this time around.
Tom Lum:
Okay, no, Tom. You had a similar thing earlier where you were like...
Tom Scott:
(snickers) Yeah.
Tom Lum:
"I haven't said anything wrong in the thing I said". And it's like, "Yeah, 'cause you said that one of our shoes is—"
Caroline:
Uh-huh, uh-huh.
Tom Lum:
Okay, so the hint was you didn't lie to us.
Tom Scott:
That's fair, I'll cop to that.
SFX:
(guests giggling)
Tom Lum:
Me and Ella's shoes. Can I ask, was it trick-or-treat themed?
Ella:
No.
Caroline:
Ooh.
Tom Lum:
Oh, I thought I was so clever with that.
Tom Scott:
The Tampa Bay Rays.
Tom Lum:
Yeah, is it relevant to the team?
Tom Scott:
Could it be related to either the team, the Rays or the Rangers?
Ella:
As far as I'm aware, the theme is not related to either of the teams.
Caroline:
Okay.
Tom Lum:
Interesting. Ding-dong.
Yes, listeners, that was me imitating a doorbell to see if that would help me at all.
Caroline:
This is the point we've gotten to. Yeah, yeah.
Tom Lum:
Ding-dong.
Tom Scott:
Okay, I'm racking my brain for... terrible sport theme nights that have existed.
Tom Lum:
Oh, yeah, yeah.
Caroline:
Mm, mhm.
Tom Scott:
There was ten-cent beer night at one baseball stadium.
Tom Lum:
Ooh, yeah.
Tom Scott:
Which ended so badly that... there were riots.
Caroline:
Oh, wow! (chuckles)
Tom Scott:
Oh yeah, it was really bad. There was Disco Demolition Night that also ended in riots.
Ella:
Oh yeah!
Tom Lum:
Historical, yeah.
Tom Scott:
Turns out in— Turns out with context, also not great.
Tom Lum:
Yeah, not good.
Caroline:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
No bueno.
Ella:
Oh, sorry. I retract that then. "Disco Demolition" sounds really—
Tom Lum:
Oh, you made it seem, Ella, I'm sure you thought it was like, for disco. It was like Disco Demolition Night.
Caroline:
Yeah!
Tom Lum:
No, no, it was...
Ella:
Oh, okay.
Tom Lum:
There's history to that.
Caroline:
Aww. Okay.
Tom Lum:
Was this themed around the podcast Las Culturistas, where they go, ding dong.
Caroline:
Wow.
Tom Lum:
Some listeners, that resonated.
Tom Scott:
That worked as well as my Noel's House Party reference did, so there's that.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Ella:
I guess think about when you would be playing the ding-dong noise.
Tom Lum:
Ella, was this a Zoom ding-dong?
Ella:
Like, a Zoom call?
Tom Lum:
Zoom, for the calling software, Zoom.
Ella:
(wheezes) No, it's just a normal doorbell.
Tom Lum:
I thought I was so clever. 'Cause 2022, people are still using Zoom a lot.
Tom Scott:
I thought it might be someone who, every time a new player enters the field—
Actually, we haven't established what sport this is. I'm assuming it's baseball?
Ella:
It is, it is baseball, it is baseball.
Tom Scott:
Yeah, every time a new player enters the field from the dugout, they play a doorbell noise?
Caroline:
Maybe there's a doorbell attached to the bat, and every time they swing and hit it...
Tom Scott:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
Huh? (wheezes)
Ella:
Well, I mean...
Caroline:
No way, Ella...
Ella:
It's not attached to the bat.
Tom Scott:
Every time there's a home run, because a door, because... the doorbell's going, and it's home? No.
Ella:
No, so, so this is in the Tampa Bay Rays ballpark. And it's played whenever the Rangers do something.
Caroline:
Do something?
Tom Lum:
Hit— Hit the ball?
Ella:
Yeah, whenever they bat.
Caroline:
Oh.
Tom Lum:
Is it just to be annoying? (wheezes)
Caroline:
Yeah, is it just as a distraction method?
Ella:
So yes, it is a distraction method. But the doorbell isn't enough to do— give a distraction. It was the theme night that came with the doorbell that added an extra element of distraction.
Caroline:
Right, okay.
Tom Lum:
Oh, there's more.
Caroline:
So the doorbell is directly linked to the theme. It's not just a random thing that was also put in there to be distracting.
Tom Lum:
The theme isn't just doorbell, is what you're saying.
Ella:
The theme is not 'doorbell'.
Tom Scott:
Everyone has to bring a door from home, and they just slam it in people's faces.
Caroline:
(laughs)
Tom Lum:
Could it be like pizza delivery or something?
Ella:
(laughs) They start throwing pizzas onto the field.
Caroline:
Oh no, I went, every time there's a pizza delivery guy on the field just walking through getting in the way, but...
Tom Lum:
To run to home, they have to be holding a pizza also.
Caroline:
Yeah. (laughs)
Tom Scott:
Is this specifically targeting some player who's had a news story?
The same way British football chants will be specifically targeted at some player who's had an incident?
Ella:
No, no, it's for every Rangers batter.
Caroline:
Interesting.
Tom Lum:
Is it like Ding Dong Ditch?
Ella:
I'll just say, what might react to a doorbell?
Caroline:
Oh my god, dogs.
Tom Lum:
A dog?
Tom Scott:
Oh.
Tom Lum:
A pet?
Tom Scott:
It was bring your dog day?
Tom Lum:
Was it pet night?
Caroline:
(gasps)
Ella:
Yeah, yeah.
Caroline:
Wow!
Tom Lum:
Oh, so that's really sinister!
Tom Scott:
Every dog in the stadium starts barking.
And the running team, fill-in team, whichever, they're just distracting with huge amounts of dogs barking. That's incredible!
Ella:
Yeah, that's it.
Tom Lum:
That's so good.
Caroline:
Wow!
Tom Lum:
That's real lateral, baby.
Caroline:
That's really clever!
Tom Lum:
From the doorbell, wow!
Ella:
So the Tampa Bay Rays were holding a "Bark in the Park" night, where the sports fans are allowed to bring along their dogs to watch.
So the announcers decided to have a bit of fun, and played a doorbell noise whenever the visiting team, the Rangers, were at bat.
And the doorbell caused all the dogs in the stadium to start wildly barking and tried to put off the hitter, basically. The aim was to put off the hitter.
Tom Lum:
Nice, and the other team had to wear a mail person uniform and run across.
SFX:
(both Toms laugh)
Tom Scott:
At the top of the show, I asked:
Hannah takes off a wrapper and sees the message "because then it would be a foot". Why?
Anyone want to take a punt at that before I give the answer to the audience?
Tom Lum:
Sounds like a Laffy Taffy joke kind of a thing.
Caroline:
I was gonna say, is it like a Penguin bar, where there would be a joke, and you would peel off part of it, and it would reveal the punchline?
Tom Scott:
It's certainly along those lines, yes.
Caroline:
Right, okay.
Ella:
Is it a Subway sandwich? (laughs) That's—
Tom Lum:
I feel like I know— I've heard this punchline before. It's like, when is a metre not a metre? Because then it's a foot, or something like that, ugh.
Tom Scott:
Yeah, I guess there's two parts to this question. One is the setup for the joke, and one is...
Caroline:
Yeah!
Tom Scott:
You're right, it's a food item. But if you just take off the wrapper and see this, something's gone wrong.
Caroline:
Oh?
Tom Lum:
'Cause then it would be a foot.
Caroline:
Is it like a Sherlock Holmes? Like, "The game's afoot, Watson"?
Ella:
Oh, is it the, oh, the name of the food, the end of it is 'foot', and just part of the wrapper makes it... (laughs) say 'foot'?
Tom Scott:
No, in time, they would see the other half of the message.
Tom Lum:
Is there something written on the bar itself? On the candy? Or on the food item?
Caroline:
We're obsessed that it's candy. Is it even that food, or is it something else?
Tom Scott:
It's something sweet.
Caroline:
Okay.
Tom Lum:
Is it a drink? Maybe a beverage or... I guess not, oh gosh.
Caroline:
Is it, you know how ice lollies sometimes have it on the stick of the thing?
Ella:
Ohh!
Tom Scott:
Yep. So what's gone wrong?
Tom Lum:
Is that what it is?
Caroline:
You've eaten part of the stick!
Tom Lum:
Oh, is it backwards?
Tom Scott:
Yep, Tom, you've got it. They put the stick in the wrong way 'round.
Caroline:
Oh, no! Oh, okay.
Tom Scott:
This is one of those ice lollies where the handle of the stick has the setup for the punchline, and once you have eaten the lolly, you get the joke.
Tom Lum:
(laughs)
Tom Scott:
And in this case, it's the wrong way 'round.
"Because then it would be a foot."
Does anyone want to try for the setup of that?
Caroline:
I went to... you ate part of the stick, which is just...
SFX:
(group laughs uproariously)
Tom Lum:
Who among us has not? Why do seagulls fly over the sea?
Tom Scott:
Because then it would be a foot.
Tom Lum:
'Cause then it would be, exactly! (laughs)
Ella:
Why... Why is a hand... not... in a sock?
Tom Scott:
Why can't a nose be 12 inches long?
Because then it would be a foot.
SFX:
(guests awing)
Ella:
The problem is, I do not know how many inches are in a foot. Because...
SFX:
(Ella and both Toms laugh)
Tom Scott:
And, with that...
Caroline:
(blurts laugh) What?
Tom Scott:
And on that punchline, thank you very much to the team from Let's Learn Everything for running the gauntlet one more time.
Let's plug, where can people find you? What are you up to? We will start with Tom.
Tom Lum:
We are at letslearneverything.com. Listen to our show.
If you like the D&D stuff at the beginning, we've done a role-playing game once where we all play rats. We do a heist as rats. And so if you're into that, it was a delightful time, but we also do other stuff.
Tom Scott:
What sort of other stuff, Caroline?
Caroline:
Oh my goodness. We talk about everything from how we make superheavy elements, to quantum physics, to the history of gossip and chess. Literally all sorts.
Ella:
And I promise I do more research than— and I know how many inches are in things when we talk on the show.
SFX:
(others laughing)
Caroline:
Yes, yes.
Ella:
I just realised I wasn't selling the science thing very well.
Tom Lum:
We will do a topic. We're actually— It's on the list to do a topic about the silliness of measure of units across the English speaking world.
Caroline:
Yeah, yeah.
Tom Scott:
Ella, where can people find you?
Ella:
letslearneverything.com and everywhere you get podcasts.
Tom Scott:
And if you want to know more about this show, you can do that at lateralcast.com, where you can also send in your own idea for a question. We are at @lateralcast basically everywhere, and there are regular video highlights at youtube.com/lateralcast.
With that, thank you very much to Ella Hubber.
Ella:
Woo-hoo!
Tom Scott:
Caroline Roper.
Caroline:
Thank you.
Tom Scott:
Tom Lum.
Tom Lum:
Ka-chow.
SFX:
(group cracks up)
Tom Scott:
I've been Tom Scott, and that's been Lateral.
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