Get the RSS feed or search “Lateral” on your podcast app
Episode 206: Chair on a pole
18th September, 2026 • Charlotte McDonnell, Libby Watson and Daniel Peake face questions about frigid food, door duties and collaborative commutes.
Transcription by Caption+
Tom:
Why did King Louis XIV of France usually eat his meals cold?
The answer to that at the end of the show. My name's Tom Scott, and this is Lateral.
Welcome to Lateral. Before today's episode, we decided to run the show through a consumer insights exercise. We assembled a representative focus group, provided some light refreshments, and asked them to evaluate Lateral across several key performance indicators. Initial feedback was promising. Participants responded positively to the show's core proposition. However, someone recommended pivoting the format toward what they described as a... "more solution-forward knowledge experience", which translated means, "Could you just tell us the answer immediately?" We logged their feedback into the strategic improvement framework before placing it into the recycling.
Staying true to their mission statement, our key stakeholders today are:
First of all, returning to the show after a little while away. Welcome back the puzzle editor for The Telegraph and quizzydan on Twitch, Dan Peake.
Dan:
Hello!
Tom:
Frantically waving at the camera there!
Dan:
I always frantically wave, and don't worry. I will not be giving any of the answers anywhere near as quickly...
Tom:
(laughs)
Dan:
as the consumers would like.
Tom:
How are Twitch puzzles going for you, Dan?
Dan:
I think we're in a bit of a renaissance, both me and particularly crosswords at the moment. There's a lot of crosswords in particular. I do some video games, sure, but I also do some crosswords, once a week, and I think we're in a really golden period at the minute. The only way you can really learn to do cryptic crosswords, which is sort of what I particularly like doing—
Tom:
Particularly British cryptics.
Dan:
Exactly. It's a very unusual thing. If you've solved an American crossword, that's a very different thing. A quick crossword, which is just definitions, that's different entirely. Cryptic, there's all sorts of wordplay and anagrams. It's impossible to learn on your own. So I highly recommend... obviously watching me, of course...
Tom:
(laughs)
Dan:
But... finding crossword streamers on Twitch or on YouTube or Minute Cryptic, that sort of thing. I highly recommend this sort of thing, because you can only learn as a group, I think. So you have to go, "Ah, this is what this clue means. You have to anagram this, or it sounds like this word." So, I— crosswords are going really well at the moment, and I think we're in a lovely sort of golden era of crosswords.
Tom:
Just checking the questions. I've got no wordplay in here. Sorry, Dan.
Dan:
I shall provide some. Do not worry.
Tom:
Alright. Alright. Well, good luck to you on the show today.
You are joined by two new players, from the What's All This Then? podcast. I'll start by going to Libby Watson. Welcome to Lateral.
Libby:
Hello. Hi. Hello.
Tom:
This is your first time on, so I have to ask: what's the podcast?
Libby:
Oh, well, it's about Britain. And it's mostly, I would say, for Americans who have lots of questions about Britain. Things like, why do you have so much nudity on television there? What's all that about?
SFX:
(Tom and Charlotte laugh)
Libby:
It's one we did recently on the podcast. Or, "What's the Weights and Measures Act?" is another one that we did recently, which sounds very boring, and it was.
SFX:
(Tom and Dan laugh uproariously)
Charlotte:
(snickers)
Tom:
Okay, well, Charlotte McDonnell, the other half of What's All This Then?, please tell me you talked about optics and, like, the precision measures in bars. We don't have free pour over here.
Charlotte:
No, I, honestly... both me and Libby have been away from the UK for such a long time. That's kind of the core of the podcast. So I don't know what you're talking about.
Tom:
Oh!
Charlotte:
(laughs) I've been gone for too long.
Tom:
(laughs)
Libby:
I think I do. Optics is the little hole they go through, the little antechamber of vodka.
Charlotte:
Oh yeah. As Libby was saying, it was very boring. I wasn't listening to what she was talking about.
SFX:
(Tom and Libby laugh heartily)
Tom:
Oh! Then sell a different episode of the podcast to us. What's your favourite? Where should people start?
Libby:
Mr. Blobby. Mr. Blobby. We did Mr. Blobby.
Tom:
Oh, yeah.
Charlotte:
We did Mr. Blobby.
Tom:
Could you not phrase it like that?
Charlotte:
We love to do Mr. Blobby.
Libby:
We love doing Mr. Blobby.
SFX:
(Tom and Dan guffaw)
Charlotte:
It was so much fun.
Libby:
He was so gentle.
Charlotte:
He had such lovely pink skin.
Tom:
Well, th— oh, how do I follow that? Good luck to both of you on the show today.
Let's activate the curiosity vertical and proceed with question one.
Thank you to David Forrest for this question.
A Brazilian agency created an advert in 2003 prominently displaying the car keys of an Alfa Romeo, a Volvo, a Mercedes, and a BMW. Who was their client?
One more time.
A Brazilian agency created an advert in 2003 prominently displaying the car keys of an Alfa Romeo, a Volvo, a Mercedes, and a BMW. Who was their client?
Libby:
Ooh, 2003, 2003. What have we got for 2003, Charlotte?
Charlotte:
Don't— Well, but how old was I, 13? So I'm not gonna be remembering much.
Tom:
Oh! Right through—
Libby:
Yeah, me too.
Dan:
Excellent. I do enjoy it when we make Tom uncomfortable.
Tom:
Right through the heart. Right?
Charlotte:
Honestly, it's been a while since I've said my age. And someone's been like, "You're young!"
Tom:
(laughs)
Libby:
I know. Isn't that so refreshing?
Charlotte:
That's so nice.
Libby:
Remember when we had Katelyn on the podcast, Charlotte, and she said— 'Cause of course, I was born in the year 2000, and I was just basically hung up right there. "What are you talking about, you were born in 2000?"
Charlotte:
I know.
Tom:
For a minute, I thought you were born in 2003, and my brain did a little bit— No, it's okay. It's okay. We're fine.
Libby:
Uh-huh.
Charlotte:
Mhm, mhm.
Libby:
No, no, no. Yeah, yeah.
Dan:
Well, I was studying for exams. That's my age, I was doing some—
Libby:
Okay, well, that's not that different. Probably about the same time, yeah.
Dan:
Yeah, roughly. Eh... cars.
Tom:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
Right. It's about cars or it's about keys, right?
Dan:
Oh, it could be a key client, couldn't it? I was entirely fixated on the cars. It's just loads of keys.
Libby:
Mm. Yeah, the client was keys. The concept of keys.
Dan:
Mhm.
SFX:
(group giggling)
Charlotte:
Have you guys thought about locking your car doors?
Tom:
(laughs)
Libby:
Yeah.
Charlotte:
Or maybe even starting your car? Like, have we got the product for you?
Tom:
Oh, but I do like that as an idea. "We stole these car keys. Here are photos of them."
Libby:
Yeah, yeah. Guess the car. Or yeah, maybe it's like, everyone's closing their doors with just a bit of string now, and we don't think that's good. We need to bring back keys. "Keys: They close your doors." It's just, idea. I don't know if the key advertising board is listening and they wanna, you know, pay me a consulting fee.
Dan:
Sponsored by Yale University.
Libby:
(laughs) Yeah. Exactly. We are, actually.
Tom:
Ohhh! That took a good three, four seconds to make its way into my head.
Dan:
Oh, I like it when you hear the penny drop
Tom:
Yeah.
Dan:
with an echo. It's lovely.
Tom:
(cackles)
Charlotte:
(snickers)
Libby:
Yeah. Yeah.
Charlotte:
Something of a puzzle, that one.
Tom:
Yeah. Yeah.
Dan:
Ehh.
Libby:
Ah— Eh—
Charlotte:
Wuh. (snickers)
Libby:
Ah! This is how we do our podcast actually is, someone says something like Yale University, oh, and I think Yale locks, and then I panic and I go, "Charlotte, well... Do you know if they have Yale locks in America?"
SFX:
(others laughing)
Libby:
"Do they have Yale locks here?" And then we do about 20 minutes on that. So...
Charlotte:
That's right.
Libby:
Yeah.
Tom:
The company in question that's being advertised here was not one of the ones I listed. It wasn't Alfa Romeo, Volvo, Mercedes, or BMW.
Charlotte:
When did they introduce AirTags? Like, after this? But I'm like, you know...
Tom:
Far after this.
Charlotte:
I'm thinking about key rings here.
Tom:
Ooh, key rings.
Dan:
Ooh.
Tom:
Yeah. Keep thinking about key rings. These keys were hung up on a rack.
Dan:
Oh, okay.
Libby:
Hmm. I have an idea, but I don't know that it makes any sense.
Dan:
Oh, you've now got to say it. You now have led yourself into saying it.
Libby:
Okay. So what I was thinking was: 2003, right? That might have been when The Italian Job came out, and which made me think, what if Italian car company, like, one of them...
SFX:
(Libby and Tom laugh)
Dan:
Alfa's, I think, Italian.
Libby:
Alfa Romeo is Italian, yeah. But what if there was another one, and they did a car advert that was like, "You're only supposed to blow the bloody doors off and buy a car"?
Tom:
I've just looked this up. Congratulations, The Italian Job was 2003. Or at least the remake of it.
Dan:
Yes. Good work.
Libby:
Yes.
Tom:
Good work.
Libby:
Perfect recall.
Tom:
Completely irrelevant to the question.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Tom:
I wouldn't concentrate on the year at all.
Libby:
Right, right, right.
Tom:
But excellent Mark Wahlberg film knowledge, I guess?
Libby:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, well, obviously I'm a huge Mark Wahlberg fan.
Tom:
Oh, yeah, obviously.
Libby:
I go to Wahlburgers every day.
Tom:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
Mhm. The benefits of being an American.
Tom:
They did try to open a Wahlburgers in the UK. I believe it has now closed.
Libby:
Damn. Wait. I need to take this opportunity to check in. What is the beloved burger chain in the UK these days?
Tom:
Ooh. Oh, difficult.
Dan:
Yeah. Burger King, sort of.
Tom:
Mm.
Libby:
Yes!
Dan:
But it's no longer what it was. I do like a good Whopper though.
Libby:
Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah, yeah. I've heard a lot of people talking about Five Guys, 'cause you've got it in London now.
Dan:
Ooh.
Libby:
But...
Dan:
I like Five Guys as well.
Tom:
Sorry, keys, folks.
Dan:
Oh, hello.
Libby:
Yeah, right.
Tom:
You've identified key rings.
Libby:
We want to talk about burgers, I guess.
Tom:
You have identified key rings. You've identified they're being hung up, and I think just before we got distracted by burgers, there was a good suggestion that went out.
Dan:
Ah. I wasn't paying attention though.
Charlotte:
I was wondering, is that all of the keys? 'Cause you said it wasn't
Tom:
Yes.
Charlotte:
that the company selling this product, whatever it is, is not one of the ones you mentioned, but was there one more key that is theirs perhaps?
Tom:
Four keys on four key rings.
Libby:
Mm.
Charlotte:
Okay.
Dan:
What were the four... cars again, Tom?
Tom:
Alfa Romeo, Volvo, Mercedes, BMW.
Dan:
There's gotta be something that connects those if those particular four...
Tom:
(chuckles pointedly)
Dan:
are used.
Tom:
I'm laughing, Dan, because yes. There is kind of a connection here. It's not between the keys.
Charlotte:
Does anyone know cars? (giggles) Because I do not.
Libby:
Absolutely zero idea.
Tom:
I'd think more about a connection between the four key rings.
Dan:
Audi has four rings.
Tom:
Yes, they do, Dan.
Dan:
So are they somehow using their competitors to advertise Audi in some way?
Tom:
Yes, they were. The four key rings are hung up and overlapping, and they make the Audi logo. The concept being that this is the best features of all those four cars combined.
Dan:
Oh, that's good.
Charlotte:
Oh.
Libby:
Those crazy guys. What are they gonna do next?
Tom:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
Anyone else wanna run out and buy an Audi right now based on that?
Tom:
It's not 2003, and I'm not in Brazil.
Libby:
No, absolutely. Oh my god. Alright. This is starting to feel like one of the dreams I have where I have to do my history GCSE again. But I haven't been going to the classes at all, and this is the question that would be on the piece of paper. And I'd be thinking, "I'm 35, why? Why am I doing this? I've got a master's degree. Why is this happening?" And then I still wouldn't wake up.
Tom:
We will go to the first of our guest questions. Dan, over to you.
Dan:
Okey-doke.
Thank you very much to Nate, who sent in this question with a bit of a bite.
After getting his wisdom teeth removed, Nate starts using two toothbrushes every time he brushes. Why?
After getting his wisdom teeth removed, Nate starts using two toothbrushes every time he brushes. Why?
Libby:
Used one toothbrush on tooth, and then the other tooth started to feel left out and said, "I want a new toothbrush too." Much like my mom would always buy me a little present when my brother got a birthday present, so I didn't feel left out.
Dan:
Aw.
Tom:
Aw.
Libby:
Participation trophy culture.
Tom:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
(snickers) Just doing two toothbrushes at the same time to clean your teeth really quickly. That's the first thought I'm having.
Tom:
Dual wielding, specifically, yeah.
Libby:
Dual wielding, right. Yes, exactly. Yeah. Mhm, mhm.
Charlotte:
Mhm., yep, mhm.
Tom:
Also, we've got two people who talk about Britain and America. Britons do not habitually get their wisdom teeth removed unless they need to.
Libby:
Right.
Tom:
Americans – all four out when you're a teenager just in case.
Libby:
Yeah. Just whip 'em out. Yeah. Exactly, yeah.
Charlotte:
They love it. They love taking those teeth out for some reason.
Libby:
Yeah, yeah. Well, they certainly love being told by their dentist, "Ooh, you, ooh, you really need to do this, and I do think you should give me $4,000 for this."
Tom:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
Mhm. Anytime we get into the territory of being British and saying that someone else is bad with teeth, I'm like...
Tom:
Yeah, let's move on. Let's move on.
Libby:
Yeah, let's just move on.
Dan:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
We should just go away real quick from all that.
Tom:
Okay, so wisdom teeth are the ones at the far back, both sides. And if all four of them have come out...
Libby:
Mm.
Tom:
then... there's suddenly a big hole there for a while.
Libby:
(wheezes)
Charlotte:
Mhm.
Tom:
There's a big hole where once there was meant to be a tooth.
Libby:
Mm.
Tom:
I'm sure it'll heal up eventually. But could that be something to do with it?
Dan:
Not particularly.
Tom:
Okay.
Libby:
Okay, no hole healing. Alright. I'll write that down.
Charlotte:
You're not— I mean, is one of them a special kind of toothbrush, I guess, is my first question. You know? 'Cause I'm— I feel like—
Dan:
What do you mean by special?
Charlotte:
Like unique in that it's just, like, it's for going down the hole or...
SFX:
(others wheeze profusely)
Libby:
Like a chimney sweep?
Tom:
Okay.
Charlotte:
Yeah, like a chimney sweep.
Libby:
Yeah.
Dan:
No.
Tom:
I cringed inter— Oh, that's—
Dan:
Moving on. No.
Tom:
Interdental brushes do exist, which are to get the gaps between gum and tooth.
Libby:
Oh.
Dan:
Indeed. And I was thinking, were you thinking of that? No, no, these are— a regular toothbrush.
Libby:
These are regular toothbrush. Okay.
Charlotte:
Is one, like, electric, and the other one's a manual?
Dan:
Ooh, yes, you're correct there.
Tom:
Ooh!
Charlotte:
Okay.
Dan:
But why?
Libby:
But why, Charlotte? And of course you have an answer for that.
Dan:
That is a great—
Tom:
(laughs)
Dan:
That is correct.
Charlotte:
Okay.
Tom:
Okay. That makes so much more sense than I'm holding two toothbrushes, which is honestly still what I had in my head at this point.
SFX:
(Charlotte and Dan laugh)
Libby:
Would you not wanna put the electric toothbrush in the hole, in case it'd spin too fast and make the hole bigger?
Tom:
Aaagh!
Dan:
Oh, people at home are gonna be loving that(!) No.
Charlotte:
(giggles)
Tom:
What does a manual do that an electric doesn't?
Libby:
It's cheap. It's cheaper than an electric toothbrush. You went and got your wisdom teeth out in America, and it costs a lot.
Tom:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
Mhm.
Dan:
I will say only one of these toothbrushes actually went in his mouth.
Tom:
Oh.
Charlotte:
Ohhh. So where did the other one go?
SFX:
(Dan and Tom laugh uproariously)
Charlotte:
Ooh, is one for cleaning something else that is going in the mouth?
Libby:
Yeah, do you get some kind of bit of apparatus when you get your wisdom teeth out? Like a mouthguard of some sort. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Charlotte:
And you clean that with the other one?
Libby:
Hole filler.
Dan:
Good thought. Not that.
Libby:
Oh.
Tom:
Has he kept the wisdom teeth? Is he polishing the wisdom teeth that are somewhere on display with a manual toothbrush?
Dan:
He might be doing that as well, but that is not the nub of this question.
Libby:
Did anyone else's moms do that, keep all the teeth that they lost in a little pill bottle in the cupboard?
Dan:
No, the Fairy— the Tooth Fairy took mine. Mine disappeared.
Libby:
Right. Well, apparently the Tooth Fairy put them back in a pill bottle in the cupboard there.
SFX:
(group giggling)
Dan:
Which of the two toothbrushes do you think went in his mouth?
Tom:
Surely the electric one.
Libby:
Surely the electric.
Charlotte:
Yeah.
Libby:
'Cause why would you use a manual, when you have the ability to use an electric? It's so much better.
Dan:
He used the manual toothbrush in his mouth.
Libby:
Oh?
Tom:
Oh!
Dan:
The manual went in his mouth.
Tom:
Okay. Hold on. Electric toothbrushes have detachable heads. An electric toothbrush can just be used as a source of either rotation or just, like, rumbling vibration. So can it be used for... (sighs) something else, like... massaging the pain points where the tooth's come out?
Libby:
Like a Theragun.
Dan:
You are right in that the electric toothbrush is used for something else.
So you've— If you've had your wisdom teeth out, there's going to be a lot of sore areas. So, you're advised not to use an electric toothbrush and just use a manual to be very gentle around some of the areas. So that's why you would use a manual.
But he was using the electric toothbrush for a purpose.
Charlotte:
Ooh, it's got a timer.
Libby:
(gasps)
Dan:
So...?
Charlotte:
We got— Are you using the electric one to be like, "Okay, 30 seconds here, 30 seconds there"?
Dan:
Exactly that.
Charlotte:
You're using— Okay, there we go.
Libby:
Right, okay. So you basically had to imagine that the person in question was a psychopath.
Tom:
(laughs heartily)
Dan:
(deflates stiffly) Thanks so much for Nate for the question.
Charlotte:
(giggles)
Dan:
This is a personal anecdote from Nate as well.
Libby:
Nate, mate, you're mental. What are you doing?
SFX:
(others guffawing)
Libby:
It's alright.
Dan:
He used one to clean, and the electric toothbrush to time two minutes, 'cause that is often a function of toothbrushes. And if you want to hear one...
SFX:
(toothbrush buzzes)
Tom:
Eyyy!
Dan:
There we go.
Charlotte:
There we go.
Tom:
Because if you have spent years relying on that timer and that routine, why would you stop using it?
Dan:
Yes, so, an electric toothbrush can be used to time. It will sort of rumble every 30 seconds. You're sort of meant to do 30 seconds in each corner of the mouth. So Nate was using that, as to do 30 seconds in each corner of the mouth, with his manual toothbrush.
Tom:
This question comes from Peter Gould. Thank you, Peter.
In some California cities, why might someone earn about $10 simply for closing a car door?
I'll give you that one more time.
In some California cities, why might someone earn about $10 simply for closing a car door?
Charlotte:
Well, I'm looking straight to Libby, who is in California right now.
Libby:
Yes. Yes. I think I maybe have an idea.
Tom:
Ooh, okay.
Libby:
But I don't have anything funny to say about it. So...
Tom:
If you think you've got the answer, I will hand it over to Charlotte and Dan. And if you realise you're wrong, come back in. But...
Libby:
It's gonna be so funny when my idea is, once again, like The Italian Job, completely wrong, and I'll be like, "Yeah, I got this one, so you guys can handle this."
Dan:
But it does not take long to close a car door, so I want this job.
Tom:
Mm.
Dan:
I could close car doors really quickly. Sometimes on people, which may be less good. But, just why would you be paid to close a car door? That's my first baffling question.
Libby:
We got all kinds of crazy stuff going on in America, you know?
Dan:
Do you not close your car doors? First of all, we've had keys. Now you're not even gonna close the doors.
Libby:
Yeah.
Charlotte:
Yeah, immediately, I'm like, "Who is paid to close a car door?" I guess if you're going to, like, a really fancy hotel... you know, somebody
Dan:
Like a valet or something.
Charlotte:
opening the door and, you know, letting out celebrities and such. But that doesn't feel like a California-specific thing, or at least not specific to, like, some cities.
Libby:
Oh, honey, all the celebrities live here.
Charlotte:
I mean, I know that. I mean, you're there, Libby.
Libby:
That's right. Mhm.
Dan:
Are celebrities involved?
Tom:
No, not at all. The problem is actually surprisingly minor.
Charlotte:
Okay, well, it's also just hot in California, right?
Dan:
The doors pop open and stay open, so you, like, have to body slam them.
Charlotte:
Are there people leaving their car doors open to keep their cars cool when they're away from them, and they're not supposed to do that?
Tom:
There are people leaving their car doors open, and they are not supposed to do that.
Charlotte:
Okay.
Dan:
'Cause why wouldn't you just leave the window open, rather than the whole door?
Tom:
Right.
Charlotte:
Right.
Tom:
And the people being paid are gig workers. They're folks running on some delivery apps or something like that, who are out and about anyway.
Libby:
Can you tell me when I can say the answer? 'Cause I'm really sure I know the answer.
SFX:
(others laughing)
Tom:
Let 'em get it. Let 'em get it. I'll hand over to you if they don't get the a-ha moment.
Libby:
Yes. Yes, I'm going, "Ooh, sir, sir, ooh, I know, I know."
Dan:
(guffaws)
Charlotte:
Mhm.
Tom:
Are you in one of the cities where this might...
Libby:
Yeah, yeah, I live in Los Angeles. Yeah, mhm.
Tom:
Yeah.
Dan:
Oh, so hang on. So this is fairly specific to California, LA, San Francisco, that sort of thing, is it?
Tom:
Yeah, a couple of other cities, yeah, and maybe London soon.
Charlotte:
Okay, so, 'cause I was thinking it must be a climate thing.
Tom:
No, not at all.
Charlotte:
No? Alright.
Dan:
Well, it can't be if it's London. Eh.
Tom:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
Exactly.
Libby:
Don't have climate there.
Tom:
Can't afford it these days, not in this economy.
Libby:
Yeah, it's too bloody expensive, isn't it? And Freddos as well.
Tom:
(chuckles)
Charlotte:
(snickers) A Freddo's still 10p, by the way.
Libby:
A Freddo's still 10p.
Dan:
I once grated the head off a Freddo.
Tom:
(blurts guffaw) That is psychopath behaviour.
Dan:
(laughs)
Libby:
Yeah, I was gonna say, was that in school, and then you got put in a special program?
Tom:
Freddo-based Saw.
Dan:
Well, I needed chocolate shavings. I had a Freddo. I had a cheese grater. I made the shavings. And no, I was not at school. I was at university, so I knew better. So I deliberately started at the head end.
Libby:
That's a very university coded activity actually.
Tom:
Yeah. The gig workers are being summoned because there's no one else around who can close it.
Dan:
So you're in the middle of a city. So it's really busy, but there's no... Oh. Hang—
Tom:
(giggles)
Dan:
No, no. Really?
Tom:
Go on, Dan.
Dan:
Oh, okay. I was in London last week, and I saw a Waymo for the first time.
Tom:
Mhm.
Dan:
And it had... It was a— It had a driver, but it was one of these driverless cars. And you said earlier, this might be coming to London. So I— Is it something to do with that?
Tom:
Libby, what were you thinking?
Libby:
I was thinking that it's maybe when people get out of their Waymos, and... maybe don't close the door properly or something, and then a Waymo employee has come...
Dan:
(gasps)
Libby:
Well, not employee, clearly. Someone getting paid $1 an hour or something. But, yeah, getting... to have to close the door, if the person taking the Waymo doesn't close it properly.
Dan:
Wow. Okay, yes.
Tom:
Yes.
Dan:
'Cause if it's a driverless taxi, and you don't close the door...
Libby:
There's no one to say, "Oi, mate, close the door," yeah?
Dan:
Exactly.
Tom:
Yeah.
Dan:
Ah.
Tom:
Absolutely right. In cities like LA and San Francisco, Waymo operates driverless taxis. Passengers can hail them via an app, but there is no driver, and so if they don't close the door properly after they leave, the car is not allowed to move, and is stuck. So Waymo has used the gig economy platforms to dispatch someone nearby who can physically close the door.
Dan:
Oh, so I would deliberately now just start leaving it open.
Tom:
Well, this—
Dan:
And then—
Tom:
I think this is gonna be a bigger problem in London. I think people are just gonna realise they can walk out in front of these cars, and they will stop. Black cabs are going to cut them off every time, because they know they will win the game of chicken.
Charlotte:
Or you're just gonna claim that Waymo as your own. I'm just always leaving the door open so I can always come back to this one. I can park it outside my house. You know, that's just mine now.
Tom:
Charlotte, we'll go to your question, please.
Charlotte:
Okay.
This question has been sent in by Sabine Weber.
On his way to and from work, Andrew collaborates on a project with some strangers that he never sees or talks to. Despite knowing that his efforts will eventually be destroyed, it makes his commute nicer. What is he doing?
I'll say it again.
On his way to and from work, Andrew collaborates on a project with some strangers that he never sees or talks to. Despite knowing that his efforts will eventually be destroyed, it makes his commute nicer. What is he doing?
Dan:
I've had Google Docs like this. "Oh, this is really good." No, it's just deleted immediately by everyone else. Thank you!
Libby:
I feel at a disadvantage here, much like I was at an advantage with the Waymo question, because I don't commute. And if I did, I would commute in my car because I live in LA. So, there's really no cooperation at all involved in—
Charlotte:
You commute from your bed to the other room, where you record the podcast.
Libby:
Yeah, sometimes.
Tom:
There was a...
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
There was a carpooling collective in a few cities for a while. Back when there used to be fees to cross certain areas if you had one person in your car. You would just pick up riders at certain areas, but... it's someone they don't see or talk to.
Charlotte:
I would say cars is not the right direction here.
Libby:
Yeah, I'm thinking train. I'm thinking... getting a free paper on the train. you know, is it Metro in London?
Tom:
We don't have those anymore.
Libby:
Oh, I'm so old.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Dan:
Destroyed. Destroyed or melted? Why am I thinking it's like moving snow out of the way? Like, so you're all having to shovel a bit of snow out the way.
Libby:
Ah.
Dan:
And then in the end it's all gonna melt, so, you know... Snow is just rain you have to move yourself.
Tom:
(chuckles)
Libby:
Now, what makes a commute nicer?
Dan:
Not having to do it.
Libby:
Yeah. Nothing.
Dan:
There is nothing— Coffee.
Libby:
Podcasts. Listening to Lateral.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
Thank you for plugging our podcast there(!)
Libby:
(giggles) You're welcome.
SFX:
(Tom and Charlotte laugh)
Dan:
Are you all trying to solve a cryptic crossword on the back of the Metro?
Tom:
(chuckles)
Dan:
And you're all needing a bit of help? You should watch, you know, et cetera.
Libby:
(snickers)
Charlotte:
Not a cryptic crossword. But you're not far, I would say.
SFX:
(Dan and Tom laugh)
Dan:
Are you teaching the driver how to drive? 'Cause they've got on the bus, they're only 18, they don't know how to drive, and it's a collaborative effort so that you don't die.
Libby:
Yeah. Talk about backseating, Charlotte.
Dan:
Ooh, mm-mm.
Charlotte:
I'm s— I will say, if he came back to it later, it's sort of like, it would've evolved.
Libby:
Evolved?
Charlotte:
If that makes any sense. It would've ev— well— Not like Pokémon, Libby.
Libby:
What is it? A bloody Pikachu?
Charlotte:
Not like Pokémon. Come on now.
Tom:
It could be bus. It could be train.
Charlotte:
It is a form of public transportation.
Tom:
If it's not bus or train, what else do we have? Tram?
Libby:
Boat.
Charlotte:
Libby has said boat. Boat is right.
Tom:
A boat commute?
Libby:
Yeah, like the one on the Thames.
Tom:
Yeah, but no one commu— Oh, okay. I know one person who commuted on that, and that's and that's because it— they were very well positioned for it, and there was a bar on board, and it was worth it for them.
Dan:
(wheezes)
Tom:
But...
Libby:
Yeah, you'd only do it as a sort of joke, wouldn't you?
Tom:
Yeah. So what cities, what regions have boat commuting?
Libby:
They have it in New York.
Charlotte:
I think 'cause you'd said New York, I will say it is in the US.
Tom:
Oh, okay. Okay.
Dan:
Is it like a communal activity if you are on a boat, like whale watching or something? "Oh, there's a whale," and then you get to put one on the whale-watching board?
Tom:
(laughs)
Libby:
Aw, that's so nice.
Charlotte:
Minus the whales, you're very, very close with the, like, it's a communal activity. Yeah.
Libby:
But it's not New York.
Charlotte:
It's not New York. No.
Tom:
Can it be, like, Seattle then? At a guess?
Libby:
I was thinking Seattle or Florida, like Everglades.
Charlotte:
Seattle is correct.
Tom:
Seattle— Oh, okay. Right. It's gonna be a weird one then. Cool.
SFX:
(Dan and Charlotte laugh)
Libby:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, I know, yeah, spotting Frasier Crane.
Tom:
(laughs)
Dan:
(snickers)
Tom:
The Frasier Crane is a type of bir— No, sorry, that was—
Dan:
Eyyy!
Libby:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Dan:
Is the weather involved here?
Charlotte:
No. I think... Think about— It's sort of like a large thing that exists on the ferry itself. The project.
Dan:
Ice hockey table.
Tom:
Giant chessboard.
Libby:
Yeah, like tic-tac-toe or something.
Charlotte:
You're so close.
Tom:
(laughs)
Dan:
Giant Pac-Man board.
Charlotte:
It's normal size for the kind of thing it is.
Tom:
(chuckles)
Libby:
Ugh!
SFX:
(Libby and Charlotte giggle)
Dan:
But it's gonna be, But it's gonna be, "Oh, I'll just do a move, and then someone else later—" That's how it's gonna evolve. It's like a game that's evolving throughout the day. Chess feels like a good thing, but...
Charlotte:
Right, but a collaborative thing, you know? We're not playing against each other. This is a group project.
Dan:
Is it a jigsaw?
Charlotte:
It is a jigsaw, yes.
Tom:
Ohhh!
Charlotte:
I was struggling, 'cause when you said crossword, I was like, "Yeah, like a puzzle." But the minute I said puzzle, then I would be, you know, I would've given the game away.
Dan:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Charlotte:
But yes. No, it is on a ferry between Bainbridge Island and Seattle. The commute is 35 minutes long. And so there would be a big jigsaw puzzle on the tables, and you would go and, you know, do your bit, go to work, come back, and be like, "Oh, the puzzle is done thanks to my fellow commuters."
Tom:
That's lovely!
Libby:
That's so nice. Yeah.
Charlotte:
Isn't that lovely?
Tom:
Thank you to Puck for this question.
Ralph builds a custom piece of furniture – a chair on a pole roughly 1.8 metres (6 feet) high. Why does the chair have 3 cm (1 inch) gaps through the middle of the seat?
I'll say that again.
Ralph builds a custom piece of furniture – a chair on a pole roughly 1.8 metres (6 feet) high. Why does the chair have 3 cm (1 inch) gaps through the middle of the seat?
Dan:
Ventilation, both ways.
Tom:
(chuckles)
Charlotte:
Just to do your business through?
Tom:
(laughs)
Dan:
(chortles)
Libby:
Very important that the holes are small as well
Charlotte:
Mhm.
Libby:
for that purpose.
Tom:
Yeah.
Charlotte:
Extruding.
Libby:
Extruding. Oh, Charlotte, I wish you had not used the word extruding.
SFX:
(others laughing)
Tom:
Extruding better than intruding in these circumstances, yes.
Libby:
Yes, absolutely. So true.
Charlotte:
I mean, I am confused about this chair. Like, how is it standing up if it's just on one pole?
Libby:
Sounds like an awful chair.
Charlotte:
Yeah.
Libby:
Pole... Why would you be on top of a pole? Some sort of Midsommar type cult activity.
Charlotte:
Mhm.
Libby:
Being hailed as the Midsommar queen.
Charlotte:
I'm thinking lifeguard. I don't know.
Libby:
Oh, lifeguard. That's gotta be it.
Tom:
Why would a lifeguard need a hole in their seat?
Libby:
For wet.
SFX:
(group laughs uproariously)
Tom:
Oh, no. I take back my scepticism. Like, solid guess. They're wearing dripping clothing, and it has to drain somewhere. I appreciate both the idea and the way you phrased it.
SFX:
(Libby and Charlotte laugh)
Tom:
In this case... this is an upholstered piece of furniture. A lifeguard would not want to be sitting on this.
Dan:
Upholstered. I was thinking tennis umpire or something.
Libby:
Oooh!
Dan:
'Cause they're quite— You know, they're— they're at about six foot. That sounds about right. Yeah.
Charlotte:
Yeah. Is the seat sort of used as part of, like, a game?
Tom:
It is used as part of something, yes. I wouldn't call it a game.
Charlotte:
Okay.
Dan:
The defendant is on trial, and will be sat up there.
Tom:
(laughs)
Libby:
Mm, on the pole, yeah. Oh, yeah, like Parliament. There's probably—
Dan:
The pole of shame.
Libby:
Yeah. We've probably got someone in a silly coat who, has been sitting on the pole for 700 years or something, right?
Tom:
No one's really sitting on the chair.
Libby:
Oh, what?!
Dan:
Why have they built it, then?!
Charlotte:
(snickers)
Tom:
Excellent question. Excellent question.
Dan:
Oh?
Charlotte:
Did someone used to sit in the chair?
Tom:
It might look like someone's sitting in the chair, but no one is.
Libby:
Oh, is this, like, to scare off herons in your garden or something? You've got a chair for a little gnome? And it's got holes in 'cause the gnome likes the holes.
Charlotte:
It's the scare chair.
Tom:
That is closer than you might think. It's not a gnome, but this chair is only about 30% the size of a regular chair. And gnome is actually not a million miles away.
Dan:
Little squirrel.
Libby:
Bird.
Dan:
Big squirrel.
Libby:
Bird gnome.
Dan:
Medium-sized squirrel.
Tom:
(belly laughs)
Charlotte:
(snickers)
Libby:
A little chair on a pole. So the pole is six feet tall, but the chair is small.
Tom:
We've been talking about hole here. I would go more with gap.
Dan:
Okay, so like a slit or a...
Tom:
Yeah, like I would say if you're picturing the thing that's being sat on, if you were sat on it looking forward, you would kind of see a U-shape. The hole is kind of in front of you, out.
Libby:
Like a toilet seat?
Tom:
If a toilet seat was very thin, yes. Or if the hole in a toilet seat was very thin and very, very short, yes.
Libby:
More like a slot.
Tom:
Yes. Yeah, slot.
Libby:
Is slot a good word?
Tom:
Slot would be a good— Slot would be a very good word.
Charlotte:
Is it meant for like an animal to sit in that is like not a human? 'Cause I guess when I was thinking small chair, I was like, is it a human chair scaled down?
Libby:
But it's not a human—
Tom:
It's a human chair scaled down. Yes.
Charlotte:
Ah, ah.
Dan:
Is it wooden? Does it have nice padding? 'Cause you said it was upholstered.
Tom:
Oh, yes, it looks like a lovely chair. Looks like a perfectly good chair. It's just too small for a human.
Dan:
If I tried to sit on it, would it break?
Tom:
Probably.
Dan:
Oh.
Charlotte:
Ooh, I'm having a thought. Is it— Is this a chair that is involved in some kind of perspective trick?
Tom:
Sort of. I wouldn't say it's full perspective trick, but certainly this is... I think suspension of disbelief more than illusion here.
Libby:
'Kay.
Charlotte:
Mhm.
Tom:
It's obvious what's going on for the 200 people or so who are watching.
Libby:
The 200 people or so?
Tom:
Mhm.
Dan:
Theatrical?
Tom:
Theatrical, Dan, yes.
Dan:
Theatrical.
Libby:
Oh, is it... Is it like Punch and Judy?
Tom:
Keep going, Libby.
Charlotte:
Chair for puppet that you need to put the hand through.
Tom:
It's a chair for puppets.
Dan:
It's a puppet!
Tom:
Yes. It's a puppet.
Libby:
It's a bloody puppet, wow.
Tom:
In this case, it's not for putting a hand through. It is for a puppet on a pole. This is a puppet theatre that our question writer started working in. their colleague Ralf builds the backgrounds and props, and the solution for having a puppet sit down is this big chair on a pole. 'Cause obviously, the puppeteers are all further down.
Dan:
Yes.
Tom:
They're all standing up. Puppet on a pole comes along, pole slides into the seat, and the puppet can sit down there.
Dan:
That's the way to do it!
Charlotte:
That's nice.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Tom:
Libby, we will get your question please.
Libby:
Yes, of course.
And this question has been sent in by Ryan in Denver.
How can the effects of the 1883 eruption of Krakatoa still be seen today, both in Oslo and on your phone?
I'm gonna say it again.
How can the effects of the 1883 eruption of Krakatoa still be seen today, both in Oslo and on your phone?
Charlotte:
Well, I got the Krakatoa app, obviously.
Libby:
(blurts laugh)
Tom:
Yep. Yep.
Dan:
This is pure Lateral. I am just boggled. My mind is boggled.
Libby:
To me, it's easy, 'Cause I've got it written down, so...
Tom:
(laughs)
Charlotte:
Well, just say it then.
Libby:
Oh, okay.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Charlotte:
You can really help us out.
Tom:
And Libby wins the question for some reason.
SFX:
(guests laughing)
Dan:
The— Of course, the eruption happened just as the sun was coming up. At the crack-atoa of dawn.
Tom:
Ohhh!
Libby:
Oh, come on!
Dan:
Sorry. No I'm not actually.
Tom:
(laughs)
Dan:
So it was the loudest event ever heard, is... I think, is that
Tom:
Yes.
Dan:
how it has been described?
Libby:
Yeah.
Dan:
Or, no, hang on.
Tom:
Yes.
Dan:
That might be Tambora a few years...
Tom:
Well, I—
Dan:
prior to that.
Tom:
I remember it being loud enough. I don't remember it. I wasn't there. I'm not that old.
Dan:
Mmn.
Tom:
I remember reading that it was loud enough that it echoed around the world. Like, that massive explosion happened, and that pressure wave rumbled around the world for days, I think.
Dan:
They were definitely able to measure it in barometers, in pressure gauges around the world.
Tom:
Mhm.
Dan:
That definitely happened.
Charlotte:
This is funny, 'cause... 'cause when I stubbed my toe the other day...
SFX:
(others laughing)
Charlotte:
everyone could hear it around the world as well.
Libby:
Around the world. And they said, "Wow, it sounded like Krakatoa."
Tom:
Yeah.
Charlotte:
Yeah. Crack-a-toe-a 'cause I hurt my toe yesterday.
Dan:
Crack-a-toe-a! (guffaws)
Tom:
Yeah.
Libby:
I don't wanna do the podcast with you anymore, Charlotte.
Charlotte:
(snickers)
Dan:
Hah!
Tom:
I feel like I should've been faster at that one. I feel like I should've noticed.
Libby:
Yeah.
Charlotte:
(snickers)
Dan:
Aah.
Libby:
I just thought it was a funny image.
Tom:
I just thought it was a stubbed toe yelling in pain. No, just really, really clever.
Libby:
I was just laughing at the idea of Charlotte stubbing her toe. Thought it's pretty funny.
SFX:
(others laughing)
Charlotte:
Libby just thinks it's funny when I'm hurt. but that's fine.
Libby:
Yeah, I do. Yeah. I wanna say all of this— all these facts are so interesting, but I don't think this has anything to do with the noise.
Charlotte:
So the loudness is not an important factor?
Libby:
No. But again, so appreciate the intel.
Dan:
Does Oslo have a do not disturb feature that Krakatoa now has?
SFX:
(others laughing)
Libby:
If it did, I might move to Oslo.
Dan:
Oh, I know very little about Oslo, but I do have a phone.
Tom:
Mm.
Libby:
Okay. What's on your phone?
Dan:
Nothing, milords.
SFX:
(others laugh heartily)
Libby:
Okay, so...
Tom:
Also, what's in Oslo? Oslo has a ski jump. Oslo has... Oslo has not much else.
Dan:
You went for a ski jump first?
Tom:
No, no, I just know it has a sl— ski jump. That's all I can remember.
Libby:
You are in possession of facts about things that I would never imagine. Oslo has a ski jump?
Tom:
That is the most interesting thing I can remember about Oslo, is that there is a ski jump. If you go to the metro station... for that ski jump... with a toboggan, you can then race the metro down like a 3–4 km
Libby:
Oh, that's awesome.
Tom:
winter track if it's in winter, and maybe get there, and then take the metro back up and do it again. When I was in Oslo, there was not enough snow for that.
Dan:
(wheezes profusely)
Charlotte:
(snickers)
Libby:
Sorry.
Dan:
Oh, dear.
Libby:
Alright, so... It's not about the sound, but think about what else an eruption might affect.
Charlotte:
Well, I'm thinking about some kind of material that has been created from the eruption.
Libby:
Okay, yeah.
Charlotte:
That might end up in a phone battery or something like that.
Libby:
You started out so well, Charlotte.
Charlotte:
(snickers)
Tom:
The weather's gonna be worse over the next couple of years, because there's gonna be a load more ash in the atmosphere.
Libby:
Yes. That is— yes, that's good. And then what might happen after that?
Dan:
Well, that ash can move about. Did it specifically go to Oslo?
Tom:
(laughs) Specifically, all of it. Oslo just wakes up the next morning like, "We've got the top of a mountain here."
Dan:
It was a bit of a shock, wasn't it?
Tom:
Yeah.
Dan:
So yeah. Rare earth elements could come out of the eruption and somehow be in our phones maybe. Is magnetism gonna be important here? Like, 'cause Oslo's sort of near a pole. It's further north than we are.
Libby:
Uh, no.
SFX:
(guessers giggling)
Charlotte:
Yeah, I'm stuck on a cloud of ash still, and you got the app on the phone to track it.
Dan:
Oh, well, hang on. Was The Scream partially inspired by this? 'Cause you would've had the very vivid sunsets all around the world.
Libby:
Dan?
Dan:
And so didn't— Yeah?
Libby:
Are you cheating?
Dan:
No! Because Oslo, Mun— Edvard Munch is Norwegian.
Libby:
You've got it! I can't believe it.
Tom:
And the phone is the screaming face emoji that's on your phone.
Libby:
Yes!
Dan:
Oh! I wouldn't have got the phone bit.
Libby:
Amazing.
Dan:
Smug Dan.
Libby:
I can't believe you've done— I can't believe you got that, 'cause I was just panicking about how the hell I was gonna lead you to that.
SFX:
(group laughing)
Dan:
It's such an iconic painting.
And people think the title, Skrik or something like that – I've written pub quiz questions on it – is called The Scream. People think it's to do with the person screaming. It's not. 'The Scream' refers to 'The Scream of Nature'. That is what the title refers to.
Libby:
Amazing. Amazing facts.
So yeah, so after Krakatoa erupted in August 1883, like you said, enormous quantities of ash and gases entered the atmosphere, which produced unusually vivid red and orange sunsets across much of the world for months. So that was nice probably for them. Many art historians and scientists believe that these strange skies were remembered by Edvard Munch, whose 1893 artwork The Scream features a dramatic, turbulent sky.
But then in 2010, Unicode 6.0 introduced an emoji for face screaming in fear, which I'm gonna do now.
There we go. Isn't that good?
Dan:
Perfect.
Libby:
Everyone said that was so good.
Dan:
Mhm.
Libby:
Which is directly inspired by The Scream. Also there are four versions of The Scream: two paintings and two pastels, as well as lithographic prints.
So that's interesting, isn't it?
Tom:
Which means we just have the question from the start of the show.
Thank you to Bradley Bruchs for sending this in.
Why did King Louis XIV of France usually eat his meals cold?
Does anyone want to take a quick shot at that?
Charlotte:
They hadn't invented ovens yet.
Libby:
They hadn't invented ovens, had they?
SFX:
(group laughing)
Libby:
No microwave.
Dan:
Cooking, fire, before all that.
Libby:
It was before fire.
Dan:
He had a really long knife and fork set, so by the time that he reeled it in, the food had gotten cold.
Tom:
Closer than you might think, Dan, but it's not the kni—
Dan:
What?
Tom:
But it's not the knife and fork that were long.
Dan:
Oh?
Libby:
Long table.
Dan:
Why did they just not serve it nearer?
Libby:
(guffaws)
Tom:
Why did they not serve it nearer? Not nearer to him, but you're right. This is a distance thing. Got that very quickly.
Charlotte:
Oh, it's being cooked somewhere that's sort of far away and being brought.
Tom:
Yes. Where might that be?
Libby:
Well, it must be in Versailles. The palace is massive.
Tom:
Yep! Absolutely right. The kitchen was so far away from the royal dining room that by the time the food got to the king, it was cold.
Libby:
Stupid, isn't it?
Charlotte:
Whose fault was that? Whose idea was that?
Libby:
I know. Can't buy sense, can you, Charlotte?
Tom:
Thank you very much to our players.
Where can people find you? What are you up to? We will start with Charlotte.
Charlotte:
Yes, the main thing to do is to check out mine and Libby's podcast, What's All This Then?, where we do, we do talk about, we do talk about Britain. I promise even if you are British, we will still have some interesting things for you to hear about it.
Tom:
Libby, what sort of interesting things?
Libby:
Oh, well, the aforementioned Mr. Blobby, of course. What else have we done? Charlotte, we've done—
Charlotte:
I really like the episode that we recorded recently about Big Ben, actually.
Libby:
(chuckles) Big Ben. Maybe our stupidest episode yet, where we didn't even explain why it was called Big Ben until almost the end of the episode.
Charlotte:
Our guest had to remind us that we should mention that. It was good.
Libby:
Yeah, that was nice of him. Yeah, it's a good podcast. Check it out. I also stream on Twitch, twitch.tv/libtron, mostly doing video games.
Tom:
And Dan.
Dan:
You can find me on Twitch as well, quizzydan, and on YouTube there. I solve various crosswords with the help of the chat, and it's very much a communal effort. I'm not saying I struggle, but I do get quite a few hints from the chat. So quizzydan, that's me.
Tom:
And if you want to know more about this show, you can do that at lateralcast.com, where you can also send in your own ideas for questions or join the Lateral Producer's Club. We are at @lateralcast basically everywhere, and there are full video episodes every week on Spotify. Thank you very much to Dan Peake.
Dan:
Ta-ta, chuck.
Tom:
(laughs) To Libby Watson.
Libby:
Bye.
Tom:
To Charlotte McDonnell.
Charlotte:
Bye-bye now.
Tom:
I've been Tom Scott, and that's been Lateral.
Episode Credits
| HOST | Tom Scott |
| QUESTION PRODUCER | David Bodycombe |
| EDITED BY | Julie Hassett at The Podcast Studios, Dublin |
| MUSIC | Karl-Ola Kjellholm ('Private Detective'/'Agrumes', courtesy of epidemicsound.com) |
| ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS | Bradley Bruchs, Sabine Weber, Ryan, Nate, David Forrest, Peter Gould, Puck |
| FORMAT | Pad 26 Limited/Labyrinth Games Ltd |
| EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS | David Bodycombe and Tom Scott |